They will know we are Christians by our love, by our love…
Is it your contention that Christians have been too tolerant?
Ryan Dobson: Absolutely. And Christians are the only ones asked to be tolerant in this culture. The homosexuals are not asked to be tolerant. Only Christians are asked to put aside their views, put aside their opinions, not speak up, not stand out. We�re asked to sit back and take a back seat to the rest of the culture. And it�s time that we stood up for what we believe in.
LEE WEBB: Well, let me give you a chance to demonstrate your intolerance, if you will. I want to show you and our viewers, comments made by folks we�ve seen in the news in recent months. The first comment comes from Reverend Joan Campbell Brown, former head of the National Council of Churches. Our reporter asked her if she believes that it�s only through the person and work of Jesus Christ that one can have eternal life. Let�s take a look at what she had to say.
Joan Campbell Brown: For me, the way to God, the way to peace is through Jesus Christ. That�s what I teach my children. That�s what I teach my grandchildren. And I believe that very, very strongly. But I also believe that for others there is a way that for them is true and precious. And I don�t deny them that reality, and I respect that.
LEE WEBB: All right, Ryan. How would you respond to her?
Ryan Dobson: Lee, I hear this thing so often. Someone says, “I believe this very strongly for myself, just not for anybody else.” I really believe they don�t believe it strongly for themselves. I believe that Jesus Christ is the only way to Heaven. I believe it strongly for myself. I believe it for everybody else, too. And I tell people, “If you don�t believe that you�re going to go to hell.” Being the president of the National Council for Churches she ought to preach that. She ought to tell everybody that. Muslims are not going to Heaven. It is a sad fact, but it is also true. And you�ve got to tell people that, not out of pride or arrogance, but out of love. Because I care about people, I�ve got to tell them what is true. And the truth is the only way into Heaven is through Christ.
James said on November 9, 2004 at 5:08 pm
Jeez! And I mean that literally. Have these people even read the bible? Do they have any conception about the tolerance preached by Jesus? I’m an atheist, and I’ve read it, but I have no idea where these people are coming from.
There is a level of hatred here that is so antithetical tyo the creed that they espouse… it’s just sickening.
I often wonder if I’m wrong in my beliefs (or lack thereof…), but if I buy into the whole endtimes/antichrist thingie, then I truly believe Bush to be the antichrist, and all these folks to be deluded by the beast.
Luckily I don’t believe in that stuff…
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brian stouder said on November 9, 2004 at 5:26 pm
yes yes –
it’s [Nance’s blog] and she can cry if she wants to, cry if she wants to;
I’d cry if Kerry won, too –
Anyway, I’m sure there’s literally NO END to self appointed ‘moral betters’ who will “lovingly” point out how far short of the mark we all are, and if Nance chooses to, she can tap this inexhaustible vein of moral vanity from now until the day we all meet our doom…. and the argumentative amongst us can answer back with equally pathetic leftwing pap, and (by implication) impugn all the people who didn’t vote in a way that pleased us as being equally ass-deep in the left-wing fever swamps.
The puritan vote was proportionally no larger in 2004 than it was in 2000, so this line of analysis of the 2004 vote strikes me as “wrong track” thinking.
But it DOES make for a fun parlor game – for awhile
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Danny said on November 9, 2004 at 6:17 pm
And as long as Christians are not flying airplanes into buildings and blowing up innocent civilians in pizza parlors, I think everyone should chill out a little.
Hitchens points out, correctly IMO, that the current administration has done more to promote “separation of church and state” in this world than anyone in recent history. The fight is against radical Islamo-facist who have hijacked a religion to advance a culture of death.
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ashley said on November 9, 2004 at 8:32 pm
Note that the USA was founded by people whose religious beliefs were so wacky the Dutch kicked them out of their country.
The Dutch.
They are probably the most tolerant people in the world. At least, until now.
When I was reading about how Muslims are not going to heaven, it reminded me of this old joke.
DId you see how annoying and knee-jerk Alan Simpson was on Bill Maher? Evidently, the right is, en masse, becoming intolerant.
I say, let’s be intolerant of intolerance. Let’s all be as intolerant and vicious as Ann Coulter. God, I wish I had her adam’s apple. Let’s all adopt Dick Cheney’s attitude.
Go fuck yourself.
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James said on November 10, 2004 at 7:38 am
Ashley:
Hah!
That comment about the pilgrims (not strictly the “founders” of our country, but still…) is something I say every Thanksgiving! I was so glad to hear someone else say that…
My version:
“The pilgrims… so annoying that even the Dutch couldn’t tolerate them…”
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Barry said on November 10, 2004 at 8:38 am
Look, the Puritans were imperfect, as humans are wont to be. A little irreverent joking about them is fine. Still, I admire their courage in moving to a foreign, hostile land in order to pursue their beliefs, and I revere–yes, revere–their accomplishments, despite their real faults.
You leftists just don’t get it. You ridicule the men & women who helped to make this country great, while you reap the benefits of living in the country they created. Please go. Please move to Canada, or Europe, or work for secession. We’ve long known that “liberals” consider themselves elite, and better than Americans, but it took the election of 2004 for “liberals” to–in your exasperation–say out loud in front of us what you’ve long said privately to yourselves.
http://washingtontimes.com/national/20041109-122753-5113r.htm
Please go. We’ll divide up the country county by county, red counties to remain in the U.S.A., blue counties to form a new independent state or states.
Obviously, we’ll have to do a bit of horse-swapping to deal with the problem of geographic isolates–blue counties surrounded by red, or red counties surrounded by blue–but we can make this work! We’ll all be happier apart than we are together! You leftists can finally re-make human nature and create Utopia on Earth!
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Danny said on November 10, 2004 at 10:46 am
Let’s all be as intolerant and vicious…
Ashley, you’re looking for something that has already found you. By any chance were you the gal sitting behind 4dbirds at the Ravens/Browns game last Sunday?
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ashley said on November 10, 2004 at 11:53 am
Danny, I hate to break it to you like this, but I have a massively large penis; and Barry, please don’t quote the Washington Times, unless you think that Sun Yung Moon is a bastion of righteousness.
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Barry said on November 10, 2004 at 12:49 pm
Ash,
I am (mercifully) not in a position to verify the size of your penis. I’ll leave that unhappy task to Danny.
As to Moon: yes, he’s a whack job. But his paper doesn’t take the Moon party line on religion (thank God, I mean, thank Sun Yung Moon).
It’s always a good idea to assess the ideology behind any supposedly objective POV or story. But sometimes the whack jobs are dead on.
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ashley said on November 10, 2004 at 2:03 pm
Barry,
“sometimes the whack jobs are dead on”. That is frighteningly true, see: The Christian Science Monitor.
When I see what the Moonies did to what used to be my favorite fishing village of Bayou la Batre, Alabama, I get reactionary. The Washington Times can’t get away with towing the Moon line on religion, but everything else (or at least, what I’ve read) is pretty much just like the Rev wants it to be.
As for the Puritans, well, I don’t think they are the ones that made this country great, but I believe they are the root of much of this intolerance.
That is one of the reasons why New Orleans is my favorite city in the world. The roots of that city are not tied to puritanical values. So I can carry my beer outside, as long as I keep it in a paper or plastic cup. They don’t have a history of legislating morality. Hell, they even have drive-thru daiquiri bars…
As far as seceding county-by-county: here is a fascinating collection of maps regarding the whole red/blue/purple/county-by-county maps.
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