Saturday morning market.

Cabbage as big as yo’ head.

Posted at 12:37 pm in Detroit life, iPhone |

90 responses to “Saturday morning market.”

  1. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 6, 2008 at 1:46 pm

    Not even a bit of cabbage at our market, dangnabit.

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  2. LA Mary said on September 6, 2008 at 2:05 pm

    Cole slaw. Nature’s perfect food.

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  3. basset said on September 6, 2008 at 3:01 pm

    Naaah, too healthy. You want something more like this:

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  4. moe99 said on September 6, 2008 at 3:48 pm

    The bbq coleslaw recipe in Joy of Cooking is the absolute best.

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  5. MichaelG said on September 6, 2008 at 4:01 pm

    Geez, Basset, one of the great things about Trader Joe’s is the wine selection. They have all sorts of interesting foreign and domestic stuff. That blue law is positively medieval. Ever hear of a TJ wine tasting? Buy an interesting looking bottle. Go out to your car, open and taste it. If it’s good, go back inside and buy a case. And indeed, bacon is the world’s most perfect food. Sorry, Mary.

    I’m doing my cleaning and laundry and vacuuming and stuff. I know. A man’s work is never done. Was cleaning the stove and have the football game on. Penn State vs. Oregon State. Why is Bob Griese still on TV? He’s horrible. OSU players are called the Beavers. The women’s’ program is the Lady Beavers. Isn’t that . . . Never mind.

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  6. LA Mary said on September 6, 2008 at 4:03 pm

    Alton Brown calls bacon nature’s perfect food. I’m ok with that. I’ve been on a coleslaw binge this summer, though. Very basic coleslaw with burgers or chicken. Can’t beat it.

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  7. beb said on September 6, 2008 at 4:23 pm

    So, LAMary, vinager coleshaw or mayo based? I prefer the creamy mayo coleshaw but vinegar’s good, too, if it’s not too tart. My wife was parcial to brocoslaw made from shredded broccolli but it never worked for me.

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  8. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 6, 2008 at 4:29 pm

    Rick Bayless t-shirt — Bacon Is Meat Candy

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  9. MichaelG said on September 6, 2008 at 4:31 pm

    I look at a lot of food porn and all the food bloggers agree about bacon being the perfect food. I’m not quite sure what the joke is. There’s a recipe for Kim Chee that I’m trying to work up the courage to make. One of these days.

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  10. Jolene said on September 6, 2008 at 4:31 pm

    The coach of the Oregon Beavers is Craig Robinson, Michelle Obama’s 6’6″ brother. Just thought you’d like to know.

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  11. moe99 said on September 6, 2008 at 4:45 pm

    Craig Robinson used to coach the Brown basketball team. This fact courtesy of my daughter, Brown ’07.

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  12. nancy said on September 6, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    Brown? Sounds like an elitist to me.

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  13. Dexter said on September 6, 2008 at 5:16 pm

    Gawdam…what do Michiganians feed them-there cabbages?(or), whatcha wanna bet Naismith’s first basketball was a Michigan cabbage?

    I bought cabbage the other day at our local farm market. I like it smothered in a covered skillet until tender and dressed with vinegar, sausage on the side…simmering the cabbage in Vernor’s ginger ale makes it all the better.

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  14. Dave K. said on September 6, 2008 at 5:23 pm

    I stopped at the local orchard yesterday, hoping for the season’s first Honeycrisp apples. The owner says they will probably start picking Sept. 20. They are the best!

    Nancy, isn’t coaching basketball at an Ivy League school kind of “uppity”?

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  15. brian stouder said on September 6, 2008 at 5:23 pm

    Speaking of Michigan and produce, Time Magazine had an article on wines produced from all 50 states…the reporter and several of his friends tried ’em all(!!) and reported on the results.

    Michigan was among the top-rated states (alongside California and others), while Indiana’s native wine was rated, and I quote: “Undrinkable”!!

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  16. Julie Robinson said on September 6, 2008 at 5:42 pm

    Best cheap cabbage main dish ever: stir fry onion and garlic, then add coarsely shredded cabbage and shredded carrot. Scramble some eggs with soy sauce and paprika and pour over at the end. All amounts flexible. A main dish for a buck or two. Yum! Serve with a side of Beano for the gaseously challenged.

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  17. brian stouder said on September 6, 2008 at 6:22 pm

    Hey – speaking of gardening – how were the Dirtbombs?

    Inquiring minds want to know!

    (and don’t say your husband and you didn’t make it out for a night together; a colorful exageration would be much more uplifting!)

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  18. Hattie said on September 6, 2008 at 6:40 pm

    My coleslaw:

    Lemon juice
    As much fresh crushed garlic as you can stand

    Don’t ask me proportions. I don’t do proportions. You must figure that out on your own.

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  19. Hattie said on September 6, 2008 at 6:41 pm

    Oh, and cabbage, shredded, of course. The best tasting cabbage comes in after the first frost, for those of you lucky enough to experience frost.

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  20. nancy said on September 6, 2008 at 6:59 pm

    The Dirtbombs were awesome — tight, fast and louder’n hell. (I had tinnitus all morning.)

    As for Michigan wine, they were obviously tasting the stuff from the Leelanau peninsula up north, where the climate is not quite Mediterranean but has excellent conditions for fruit-growing. We stopped at Black Star Farms on our fellowship trip up there and drank some very nice wines.

    And Indiana’s in good company. I had some Ohio wines once at a tasting that made me grateful for the spit bucket.

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  21. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 6, 2008 at 7:25 pm

    Bloomington, IN, makes a good mead at the Oliver Winery (as a Purdue alum, you know it must be true if i speak well of them). The fruit wines are good if you want something to pour over pancakes, but the mead is light and tasty but delicate.

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  22. moe99 said on September 6, 2008 at 7:51 pm

    Below is a paragraph from this week’s Time magazine article on Sarah Palin:

    “[Former Wasilla mayor] Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. “She asked the library how she could go about banning books,” he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. “The librarian was aghast.” The librarian, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn’t be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire her for not giving “full support” to the mayor.”

    Mary Ellen Baker resigned from her library director job in 1999.
    Here is the list of books Palin tried to have banned. As many of you will notice it is a hit parade for book burners.
    A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess
    A Wrinkle in Time by Madeleine L’Engle
    Annie on My Mind by Nancy Garden
    As I Lay Dying by William Faulkner
    Blubber by Judy Blume
    Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
    Bridge to Terabithia by Katherine Paterson
    Canterbury Tales by Chaucer
    Carrie by Stephen King
    Catch-22 by Joseph Heller
    Christine by Stephen King
    Confessions by Jean-Jacques Rousseau
    Cujo by Stephen King
    Curses, Hexes, and Spells by Daniel Cohen
    Daddy’s Roommate by Michael Willhoite
    Day No Pigs Would Die by Robert Peck
    Death of a Salesman by Arthur Miller
    Decameron by Boccaccio
    East of Eden by John Steinbeck
    Fallen Angels by Walter Myers
    Fanny Hill (Memoirs of a Woman of Pleasure) by John Cleland
    Flowers For Algernon by Daniel Keyes
    Forever by Judy Blume
    Grendel by John Champlin Gardner
    Halloween ABC by Eve Merriam
    Harry Potter and the Sorcerer’s Stone by J.K. Rowling
    Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets by J.K. Rowling
    Harry Potter and the Prizoner of Azkaban by J.K. Rowling
    Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire by J.K. Rowling
    Have to Go by Robert Munsch
    Heather Has Two Mommies by Leslea Newman
    How to Eat Fried Worms by Thomas Rockwell
    Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain
    I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angelou
    Impressions edited by Jack Booth
    In the Night Kitchen by Maurice Sendak
    It’s Okay if You Don’t Love Me by Norma Klein
    James and the Giant Peach by Roald Dahl
    Lady Chatterley’s Lover by D.H. Lawrence
    Leaves of Grass by Walt Whitman
    Little Red Riding Hood by Jacob and Wilhelm Grimm
    Lord of the Flies by William Golding
    Love is One of the Choices by Norma Klein
    Lysistrata by Aristophanes
    More Scary Stories in the Dark by Alvin Schwartz
    My Brother Sam Is Dead by James Lincoln Collier and Christopher Collier
    My House by Nikki Giovanni
    My Friend Flicka by Mary O’Hara
    Night Chills by Dean Koontz
    Of Mice and Men by John Steinbeck
    On My Honor by Marion Dane Bauer
    One Day in The Life of Ivan Denisovich by Alexander Solzhenitsyn
    One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest by Ken Kesey
    One Hundred Years of Solitude by Gabriel Garcia Marquez
    Ordinary People by Judith Guest
    Our Bodies, Ourselves by Boston Women’s Health Collective
    Prince of Tides by Pat Conroy
    Revolting Rhymes by Roald Dahl
    Scary Stories 3: More Tales to Chill Your Bones by Alvin Schwartz
    Scary Stories in the Dark by Alvin Schwartz
    Separate Peace by John Knowles
    Silas Marner by George Eliot
    Slaughterhouse-Five by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
    Tarzan of the Apes by Edgar Rice Burroughs
    The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain
    The Adventures of Tom Sawyer by Mark Twain
    The Bastard by John Jakes
    The Catcher in the Rye by J.D. Salinger
    The Chocolate War by Robert Cormier
    The Color Purple by Alice Walker
    The Devil’s Alternative by Frederick Forsyth
    The Figure in the Shadows by John Bellairs
    The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck
    The Great Gilly Hopkins by Katherine Paterson
    The Handmaid’s Tale by Margaret Atwood
    The Headless Cupid by Zilpha Snyder
    The Learning Tree by Gordon Parks
    The Living Bible by William C. Bower
    The Merchant of Venice by William Shakespeare
    The New Teenage Body Book by Kathy McCoy and Charles Wibbelsman
    The Pigman by Paul Zindel
    The Seduction of Peter S. by Lawrence Sanders
    The Shining by Stephen King
    The Witches by Roald Dahl
    The Witches of Worm by Zilpha Snyder
    Then Again, Maybe I Won’t by Judy Blume
    To Kill A Mockingbird by Harper Lee
    Twelfth Night by William Shakespeare
    Webster’s Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary by the Merriam-Webster Editorial Staff
    Witches, Pumpkins, and Grinning Ghosts: The Story of the Halloween Symbols by Edna Barth

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  23. Calliope said on September 6, 2008 at 8:19 pm

    Moe, while it’s true that Palin fired the librarian (who was later re-instated), that list is false. There are books on there, such as the Harry Potter titles, that were published years after Palin fired the librarian.
    “In December 1996, Emmons told her hometown newspaper, the Frontiersman, that Palin three times asked her — starting before she was sworn in — about possibly removing objectionable books from the library if the need arose.

    Emmons told the Frontiersman she flatly refused to consider any kind of censorship. Emmons, now Mary Ellen Baker, is on vacation from her current job in Fairbanks and did not return e-mail or telephone messages left for her Wednesday.

    When the matter came up for the second time in October 1996, during a City Council meeting, Anne Kilkenny, a Wasilla housewife who often attends council meetings, was there.

    Like many Alaskans, Kilkenny calls the governor by her first name.

    “Sarah said to Mary Ellen, ‘What would your response be if I asked you to remove some books from the collection?” Kilkenny said.

    “I was shocked. Mary Ellen sat up straight and said something along the line of, ‘The books in the Wasilla Library collection were selected on the basis of national selection criteria for libraries of this size, and I would absolutely resist all efforts to ban books.’”

    Palin didn’t mention specific books at that meeting, Kilkenny said.”

    So there actually isn’t a specific list of books available: but that certainly doesn’t mean Palin wasn’t trying to ban books.

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  24. MaryC said on September 6, 2008 at 8:31 pm

    moe99, where did you get that list of banned books? I’m no Palin fan but it struck me as fishy. I doubt very much if Palin has heard of half of these books, let alone knows what they contain. Unless this is something that was passed along to her, by her church maybe, I find it hard to believe that she presented the local library with something this explicit and detailed.

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  25. moe99 said on September 6, 2008 at 8:31 pm

    Mea culpa. I had received this via email from a professor of English at a Seattle college, and assumed his source was true. Guess we can all be taken in. Mea maxima culpa to the group.

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  26. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 6, 2008 at 8:42 pm

    Calliope, thanks. Moe99, this is a challenging season for all of us — i want Obama to be a national leader of some sort, i really do. I’m not sure if Palin is the best possible ideal person in the Naval Observatory, but i’m still leaning towards her rather than creepy plagiarizer Biden, while i grant the honor of those who demur. Cooze, i dislike much of the national party apparatchiks of the GOP as much as you do, which is why i’m a McCain supporter.

    If i could, i’d vote for Teddy Roosevelt and Martin Luther King, Jr. (not necessarily in that order). Given the choices we have . . . hey, i work with almost all Democrats in state level stuff here in Ohio, and then with R’s on the county level, but just promised the D candidate for commissioner my vote and my voacl support to join the two R’s currently seated. He knows i’ll deliver.

    Back to produce and kimchee and BBQ . . .

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  27. Jolene said on September 6, 2008 at 8:44 pm

    moe, how did you happen upon this list? I ask because there are Internet rumors* to the fact that the list is, in fact, a list of books that have been banned somewhere at one time or another. In particular, the first Harry Potter book wasn’t released in the U.S. until September, 1998, but the dispute in Wasilla over book-banning is said to have occurred in 1996. At this point, it seems clear that Palin discussed the possibility of banning books w/ the librarian, which is bad enough, but much less clear that any books were ever banned.

    *I hate to cite Michelle Malkin for anything because she is the meanest person on the planet, but what the heck. She seems to be right in this case.

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  28. Jolene said on September 6, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    Wow, what a busy little group of fact-checkers we are!

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  29. Jolene said on September 6, 2008 at 8:52 pm

    Here’s a little Sarah Palin humor for you.

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  30. brian stouder said on September 6, 2008 at 9:02 pm

    Jolene, Good stuff! (loved the way she met her husband)

    And – great to hear that Dirtbombs was fun, even if you can’t hear anything else, the day after.

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  31. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 6, 2008 at 9:11 pm

    Huh? What?

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  32. moe99 said on September 6, 2008 at 9:11 pm

    this is an article published in the local Alaska paper. the Mat Su Valley Frontiersman at the time of the attempted book banning. Seems like Mayor Palin really was getting into this loyalty stuff way back when. She seems to be a worthy successor for Cheney, especially as she’s getting her ‘hiding out’ practice in early.

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  33. brian stouder said on September 6, 2008 at 9:23 pm

    moe, yes; the idea that this would-be Vice President of the United States is above and need to sit down with the press and answer some questions (not even to mention stand up to a podium and take all comers) is somewhat astounding. (question: if she was NOT a ‘snap pick’, then why the blazes is she so unprepared for even the campaign cycle – never mind actually governing! – that the McCain campaign absolutely DARES NOT allow her to speak unless she has a script, and/or a “fully vetted” friendly questioner? And these anti-Obama people try and sell the lie that Obama cannot operate without a teleprompter!! It looks very like Palin is strictly a ‘show-horse’)

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  34. Jolene said on September 6, 2008 at 11:21 pm

    In case you missed it, Jon Stewart on John McCain and the RNC. Stewart has been, by the way, one of McCain’s many fans (or, at least, friends) in the press and the entertainment world (Warren Beatty is another.), so this is either just calling it as he sees it or laying it on thick because the guy is selling out to win.

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  35. Suzi said on September 6, 2008 at 11:41 pm

    Palin is about due to step in something in front of many open mics and rolling cameras, her handlers can’t be with her every minute and she’s not going to be scripted for every appearance.

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  36. Suzi said on September 6, 2008 at 11:57 pm

    Most public libraries in the US base their challenged material policies on guidelines from the American Library Association.

    That banned book list may have come from the ALA. Banned Book Week is coming up — Sept 27-Oct 4.

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  37. Suzi said on September 6, 2008 at 11:59 pm

    Chappell’s Seafood on Broadway in Fort Wayne serves a coleslaw that has shredded crabmeat in it, along with the usual creamy coleslaw ingredients — good stuff!

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  38. brian stouder said on September 7, 2008 at 12:25 am

    Suzi – I confess I have never done Chappell’s; seafood has no charms for me.

    If we go out for a reeeally good dinner, it’s Cork ‘n Cleaver; for top dollar, I want something that used to “moo”. Plus, they have the best salad bar EVUH! (it has heart of palm, which I LOVE; all sorts of lettuces and leafy spinach, herring, garbonzos, strawberries, several sorts of olives, caviar, and other goodies!)

    But I will say, the best salad in town is (of course) Casa’s.

    We’ve done Eddie Merlot’s a few times; one of those places where you order your steak, and then anything else is seperate; basically a hundred dollars to feed two people , assuming you ordered a Diet Coke and not a mixed drink!

    I confess that their Oscar Style Prime Rib Eye is almost better than wild sex (after you finish eating it, you’re done for the night anyway)…and I’d never been in a restaurant where the wait staff specifically scrapes the crumbs off the table cloth between courses (and boy, I’m a PIG! judging by all the crumbs they get from in front of me)…but Cork’s Prime Rib and that salad bar brings us back time and again

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  39. MichaelG said on September 7, 2008 at 1:28 am

    For some reason I just can’t see “Fanny Hill” on the shelf at the Wasilla library. And if it ever had been there, some kid would have stolen it. It was the first dirty book I ever read back when I was 12 or 13. I swiped it from my dad’s stash. Hard to believe he spent six years in the Catholic seminary. Thank somebody he quit before he was ordained.

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  40. MichaelG said on September 7, 2008 at 1:37 am

    Forgot the cabbage recipe. Shred one. Chop three Granny Smith apples. Chop an onion fairly fine. Melt a stick of butter in a pan (a big pan, I use my wok) and throw the above in over medium to low heat. Toss. Cover. Sweat the stuff, stirring until limp. Combine cider vinegar, a very small touch of nutmeg, sugar, cayenne or red pepper flakes to taste and dump in the cabbage. Stir. S & P to taste. Eat. Excellent on the second and succeeding days. Good sweet and sour stuff.

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  41. Gasman said on September 7, 2008 at 1:50 am

    For all of you conservatives that think the McCain/Palin ticket represents what is best about America, there is this little gem from KOAT TV, the ABC affiliate in Albuquerque, New Mexico. This is but a video menu and it defaults to another story, so after following the link, look for the story entitled “Two People Removed From McCain Rally” in the picture menu bar beneath the playback window:

    In my estimation it fairly sums up the difference between the two campaigns and the four candidates. McCain/Palin have to totally manage and control their events down to who can and cannot enter. The Obama/Biden events are absolutely open.

    It seems that a couple of undecided voters had tickets to the McCain/Palin rally here. They were going with an open mind to see what the two Rs had to say. As they were in line waiting to get in, there were Obama supporters on the other side of the street protesting. Ms. Carpenter shouted “Go Obama” and for that sin, was refused entrance into the event. She had tickets, but because she had the temerity to utter Obama’s name, they were denied entrance. So much for the McCain campaign’s devotion to free speech. Guess who Ms. Carpenter is not going to vote for now? Bush required loyalty oaths for people to get into his campaign events in 2004 and now McCain will ban anyone who even utters Obama’s name? How is that representative of what’s best about America? How does McCain expect to win over undecided voters by exercising such junior fascist tactics?

    McCain supporters, why is this acceptable? How does this comport with the McCain/Palin campaign rhetoric? Why should anyone who values free speech even remotely consider voting for this pair of phonies? How much do you want to bet that this happens at every single McCain/Palin event? Is this how they would govern?

    In comparison, Obama gave a heckler the mic at an event on August 1 in Florida. He gave him the mic and let him talk!:

    Obama treated them with respect and addressed each and every issue that their spokesperson voiced. He also defended them from the crowd.

    What do you think the chances of that happening at a McCain rally? I’ll tell you: ZERO! It ain’t gonna’ happen because they wouldn’t let them in the door. The hecklers at the Obama event brought in a banner and in Albuquerque a woman wasn’t allowed to enter because she dared to speak Obama’s name. She wasn’t even in the hall yet. Which presidential candidate sounds more secure in their message?

    If they are so confident that their message is right for America, why do they stoop to such pettiness? Come on! This is crap! They clearly don’t believe their own hype. If they did, they wouldn’t be so scared about letting only the “chosen” few into their events. They have to have staged, culled, hand picked audiences. They are so going to lose.

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  42. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 7, 2008 at 7:24 am

    ‘Scuse, but how many rabid right-wing protestors interrupted Sen. Obama’s (or Sen. Biden’s) acceptance speech? John McCain got interrupted by at least three trying to break his rhythm or get on nat’l tv or both, and i never read a precise number for Gov. Palin’s but i heard at least one.

    All the campaigns have to manage their events to some degree — that dog won’t hunt. And the 20 jugs of urine the St. Paul police confiscated from some guys planning to lead protests . . . sheesh.

    Hey, Palin may very well step in it big time on the stump: we’ll see. But if you insist on your right to put a big steaming pile under her foot, that doesn’t quite constitute stepping in it, just makes you an ol’ poop.

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  43. Jolene said on September 7, 2008 at 8:26 am

    Gasman, I agree that Obama was very impressive in that Florida meeting, but McCain is generally pretty calm about handling disruptions too.

    I’ve seen several clips in which people disrupted his townhall meetings, and, if the person actually wanted to communicate, he heard them out. If the person only wanted to disturb the proceedings, he kept the rest of the audience calm, acknowledging the protester’s right to protest, until he or she was removed.

    I don’t know what his policies are. Have just seen these few clips. It may be that the incident you describe seems inconsistent w/ what I’ve observed because it occurred outside before McCain himself had a chance to handle it.

    In any case, I don’t think he is nearly in the same category as GWB was w/ regard to excluding people who don’t agree w/ him.

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  44. jcburns said on September 7, 2008 at 9:48 am

    Jolene, all the evidence points to as much of a lockdown at McCain’s rallys as at Bush’s. (See above.) However, some determined disruptors have successfully made it in to McCain’s speeches.

    I think the difference (and it’s a big one) is: NO loyalty test to attend an Obama event. YES loyalty test to attend a McCain event…how perfect McCain’s screeners have been is debatable, but the fact that his events are screened is not.

    Obama’s are NOT screened (other than Secret Service for, y’know, people who would kill him.) he’s welcoming people in hopes that they’ll be persuaded. That’s the point of a political speech, as many Republicans seem to have forgotten.

    BIG difference.

    And another way that McCain continues Bush’s policies.

    I just think it’s as important a part of our first-amendment freedom of speech to be able to attend and listen to a speech from ANY politician, without first being vetted to make sure you’ll do nothing but support the speaker…that you’re already in the speaker’s camp.

    And by the way, I am NOT in favor of heckling the speaker or disrupting (a boo or two is OK, though).

    On the other hand, I can understand the frustration of the disruptors if their freedom of expression has been locked down in such a militaristic manner.

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  45. Gasman said on September 7, 2008 at 10:30 am

    This dog is huntin’ fine! My last post is demonstrable proof as to how controlling the McCain campaign is. This isn’t keeping out people intent on violence or those staging some kind of major disruption. This is an Orwellian homogenization of the audience to make it appear that McCain has greater support than he does. Yet another lie. When does the “Straight Talk” kick in? This is not representative of democracy and it certainly doesn’t respect free speech. Just another example of what is wrong with the Republican nominee. They are so going to lose.

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  46. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 10:31 am

    “Hey, Palin may very well step in it big time on the stump: we’ll see. But if you insist on your right to put a big steaming pile under her foot, that doesn’t quite constitute stepping in it, just makes you an ol’ poop.

    I predict she’ll handle that all on her own.

    Brian. I love C ‘n C, too, had a great dinner there last week and we’re still talking about it — prime rib, the salad bar and the mud pie. Our fav steaks are at Blu Tomato & Casa Grille, tho.

    Michael G.’s s’ns cabbage sounds fabulous – way lotta butter in that dish . . . but, yum!

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  47. Danny said on September 7, 2008 at 11:31 am

    Brian, no seafood? Not even fresh fish like salmon and trout?

    I’m with you on shellfish. Having grown up in Maryland and having worked on a commercial crabbing vessel during my teenage years, I’ve had my fill of shellfish. Crustaceans are essentially bugs of the sea and scavengers and other shellfish are more or less filters for all the crappy stuff. So, while I’ll have crabs once in a while when visiting back home (though I didn’t my last two trips), I never eat them anywhere else. They’re just not that good for you and there are plenty of other things that are not good for you that I find more appetizing and would rather use my health credits upon.

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  48. Jolene said on September 7, 2008 at 11:35 am

    Hey jc: I admit that I don’t know the policies of either McCain or Obama w/ regard to admitting people to their speeches or handling disruptions. I have seen McCain “protect” protestors from crowds who were trying to shout them down, as I described above, and I thought I’d heard him say that he takes all comers.

    Would be interesting to know what the campaigns say their policies are and what their record of following those policies is. I do agree that this is a very important issue. Both the prez and the veep should be able to handle any reasonably respectful question from anyone, so I’m very offended by policies that exclude people and by candidates who hide from the press.

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  49. brian stouder said on September 7, 2008 at 11:51 am

    Danny, Pam does the Sea Bass thing every so often…but my conservative nature demands that if I’m ordering a $30 entree’, it MUST be beef! (although the lamb looked interesting; they’ll bring an uncooked rack of it out for your inspection before ordering, if you want).

    Once, long ago at an upscale Chinese restaurant, I was adventurous and ordered duck ….and it was just not my cup of tea

    I will say that crabcakes and bisque off the lunch menu in eastern Maryland was some of the best stuff I’ve had (and probably the best $6 I ever spent!)

    PS – Friend of NN.c Alert! The almighty Sunday edition of the Fort Wayne Journal Gazette published the first chapter of a fictional mystery series by Emma Downs, titled “Death in the Fort” today.

    Lookout Laura Lippman!

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  50. moe99 said on September 7, 2008 at 11:52 am

    Looks like the ghost of Donald Segretti is alive and well in the Republican party:

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  51. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 11:56 am

    Danny, what seafood eateries do you like in your part of the world?

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  52. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 12:03 pm

    I’d love to go to a McCain/Palin rally and ask Sarah (with cameras rolling), “so banned any books lately?” See if she implodes or bites me.

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  53. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 12:07 pm

    “This is an Orwellian homogenization of the audience to make it appear that McCain has greater support than he does. ”

    Might explain all the empty seats at the convention. Too many wanna be attendees were probably vetted right out the door, or busted in the preemptive raids for lack of Republican neo-con wing-nut purity.

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  54. basset said on September 7, 2008 at 12:09 pm

    going waaaay back up the thread for replies… Jeff, I’m with you on the Oliver mead. I was at IU when it was still a dollar-69 a bottle and sealed with wax… and their other wines are indeed a little on the sweet side.

    MichaelG, the wine selection is indeed one of the best things about Trader Joe’s… but here in Tenn. you can’t buy wine in any grocery store. so I go to the liquor store where George Jones had the famous lawnmower incident some years ago, it’s not far from where I work… they sell what looks like odd lots and overstocks, three for $10.99, for $15, or for $21, and get whatever has an interesting label.

    not enough of a wine expert to know what I’m not supposed to like, so I just taste it and go from there. some is good, some less so.

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  55. Julie Robinson said on September 7, 2008 at 12:13 pm

    Restaurants in the Fort: C&C is always great, and not expensive if all you get is the salad bar. Hunks of meat don’t do much for me, but that salad bar is nirvana, and the hubby can get a steak. Very attentive waitstaff.

    We tried Granite City and they had some very fine coleslaw–creamy and melt in the mouth smooth.

    Eddie Merlot’s: Snotty and overpriced for food that is nothing special. Casa’s: friendly and reasonably priced for very special food.

    Did anyone else’s ears prick up when they heard that Todd and Sarah Palin eloped? Isn’t that a code for saying she was pregnant? Marriage date: Aug. 29, 1988, Track birthdate: Apr. 20, 1989. Hmmm…

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  56. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 12:20 pm

    Like mother, like daughter?

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  57. brian stouder said on September 7, 2008 at 12:33 pm

    thats huge!!!!!!!!!its as big as a watermelon?i wonder who harvested it. the must take really good care of their stock!!!

    NOTE: this post was written by my 10 year old; I was tied up fixing dinner, and she saw that I had left NN.C up on the screen.

    Kids, nowadays!

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  58. Danny said on September 7, 2008 at 12:47 pm

    Suzi, we prefer doing our own seafood at home and Trader Joes usually has a great selection of vacuum-sealed, fresh-frozen fish. But for eateries, we like The Fish Market. Either the downtown or Del Mar locations. And our favorite is to sit at the oyster bar there. You get the full menu and the great ambiance of the people and the cooks preparing food right in front of you.

    For back in Maryland, Brian nailed it. Hole-in-the-wall crab houses are awesome.

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  59. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 1:13 pm

    Is the downtown Fish Market the one near the Broadway Pier that’s right on the bay? I think Bob and I ate there on New Year’s Eve once, watched all the party boats cruising by and saw the resident junk all lit up like a dragon boat and full of revelers. We had a nice lunch of Alaskan halibut at Point Loma Seafood in June — great fish, coleslaw, too, and a fun spectacle of people hub-bub. The oyster bar sounds like a great spot.

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  60. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 2:27 pm

    Conservatives don’t go to the link below. Warning — you won’t like it at all, the rest of youse may get a chuckle out of it:

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  61. Joe said on September 7, 2008 at 2:44 pm

    Wow, now, all you need is Henry’s cole slaw recipe!

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  62. MichaelG said on September 7, 2008 at 2:55 pm

    Fresh Dungeness crab right off the boat in Arcata. Tomales Bay oysters right out of the water at Tomales. Mussels plucked from the rocks at Point Pinos. Fresh abalone from the waters north of Fort Bragg. Lots of other fresh fish and seafood available around here. Yum. I guess fruits de mer are an acquired taste and the acquisition maybe has to do with where one has spent most of one’s life.

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  63. Catherine said on September 7, 2008 at 3:01 pm

    Coleslaw: The Old Bay recipe on their website — except save half the dressing to use another time.

    Book banning list: As a former cast member of The Frogs (performed in Greek!), I love that Aristophanes made the list. Still pissing off The Man, 2500 years later!

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  64. moe99 said on September 7, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    My Fort Wayne restaurant memory is one named Johnell’s. Had french cuisine, and was very high brow back in the late 60s. My mother promised to take me there if I got my hair cut. It was below shoulder length, which was de rigeur for girls at that time, but she also wouldn’t pay for contact lenses, so I agreed, got my haircut and it was sort of like Twiggy’s (for which I was mightily embarrassed) but I got the dinner at Johnell’s and all I remember is that a glass of coke was 50cents, which was exorbitant since I could still get a nickel coke at Daoust’s Drugstore walking home from high school.

    And not to be without a political note of the day:
    Wasn’t it PT Barnum who said, “You’ll never go broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public.”?

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  65. brian stouder said on September 7, 2008 at 3:27 pm

    Cafe Johnelle’s closed down; I believe it was owned by a fellow named Spillers.

    I always heard that it was Fort Wayne’s only 5-star restaurant, although I never made it into the place.

    It was said that a French teacher at good ol’ South Side would take his class there

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  66. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 7, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    Ah, Mark Morford. He of “the Lightbringer” meme.

    Conservatives, fear not, click ye, all of it. It’s funny, if you turn your head a bit to the . . . right, while reading it.

    Anyhow, Republicans don’t need God, right? We’ve got all the money, plus that soul-swapping deal with Mr. Asmodeus, so it’s all good. That’s why our balloons drop and yours get stuck in the rafters (mwahahahahaha…..). We can even target Andrea Mitchell with them if we so choose, and we so choose.

    Suzi, no kidding — thanks for the link, it made me laugh!

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  67. Suzi said on September 7, 2008 at 3:34 pm

    John and Jane Spillson owned/ran Cafe Johnelle. My parents knew them pretty well — a couple of colorful characters!

    Joseph DeCuis is the current local top-notch eatery down in Roanoke.

    Jeff, I’m glad you enjoyed it, great scary laugh — mwahahahahaha……

    I like the line about throwing the kid under the wheels.

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  68. Julie Robinson said on September 7, 2008 at 4:34 pm

    We won a dinner at Johnell’s once and it was good food, but again, a little too snooty/snotty for me. My overwhelming memory is of the waiter wrestling with the pepper mill–I swear the thing was 3 feet tall!

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  69. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 7, 2008 at 5:08 pm

    This isn’t red meat for the right, but an interesting wider view of trends by David Frum —

    I’ve been bemused by the number of liberal commenters (not here, btw) who try to say that somehow the conservative and even “religious right” is now hypocritical because we’re pro-life and pro-family, but now we’ve created part of the setting for an increase in single motherhood (which Bristol Palin won’t be, but anyhow), which is the heart of Charles Blow’s op-ed in the Saturday NYTimes —

    Frum answers — true. Pro-life as a higher value has necessarily meant a wider acceptance and even affirmation, up to a point, of single motherhood, and that creates some interesting tensions that are still working themselves out.

    Myself, i think the tension is less than it looks, and was never there — young unmarried mothers have always been in the picture, and sending them out the church door alone on a winter night barefoot, shunned by all, is good Silas Marner-type material, but just hasn’t been true among evangelicals and even most stripes of fundamentalism. The tension is in going from shame perhaps once overplayed to now celebration . . . perhaps a bit overplayed. We can affirm and support without being thrilled that the number of one-parent households is going up, but it will continue to be a delicate balance.

    How Blow and others can say with a straight face that “we” on the right should accept more abortions in order to have more two-parent families, or we’re inconsistent, is another sign that we tend to talk past each other on this particular divide, but Frum makes a good attempt at putting some guide ropes up across the chasm.

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  70. nancy said on September 7, 2008 at 6:06 pm

    Well, guide ropes will be very useful, but here are mine:

    Those of us on the center-to-left who are calling the right hypocritical are not questioning Palin’s choices, or those of her family. It’s a free country, etc. What I’m talking about is the 180 the entire conservative movement seems to have done on the cultural topics of sex and pregnancy in younger people in the course of about 48 hours. Remind me: Aren’t these the ones who said kids shouldn’t have birth-control information (and certainly not birth control devices or drugs)? Aren’t they the ones who oppose the HPV vaccine? Haven’t they been carping about the “corrosive culture” that celebrates single motherhood among Hollywood celebrities, when single motherhood among regular folks is a recipe for disaster? I believe they have.

    And yet, somehow, this teen pregnancy and shotgun wedding is OK?

    The folks at Sadly, No went through postings at The Corner when Jamie Lynn Spears announced her pregnancy a few months ago. Here we have very similar situations — girls the same age, with the same plans to marry, with enough income not to need welfare, with family support to help them afterward.

    Lisa Schiffren: Perhaps consequences beyond baby showers are in order. I am not suggesting that she be whipped, or made to wear a scarlett A, or given lashes. I am, however, saying that perhaps there is some “moral turpitude” clause that might take her out of the public eye…

    Kevin McCullough strikes a Palinesque tone of sarcasm: Jamie Lynn Spears pregnant and you know oh well, sometimes things just happen right? That shouldn’t disqualify Jamie’s mom from writing a book on parenting. I mean she’s always been a good kid right? Never missed a curfew right? So mom let’s the 19 year old boyfriend move in – its all good. Friends sometimes we need judgement in making choices as parents.

    Needless to say, the reaction to young Bristol’s pregnancy was, um, different. No one advocated keeping her off the stage, or “consequences beyond baby showers.”

    This is the hypocrisy I’m talking about. This is the bullshit that makes me climb the walls, and David Frum knows it’s out there, and he ignores it. What’s more, he approvingly quotes some right-to-lifer’s teenage daughter, saying she would just have her out-of-wedlock baby and mom would take care of it so she could finish school. That’s ducky for them, but this has been standard operating procedure in the black community for generations, and these very same people have been tut-tutting over the crisis in unwed pregnancy all the while.

    So which is it? We all know life throws you curves, and I can’t say I’d argue with any part of the Palin family’s coping strategy. But why won’t they let everyone else do the same thing without Dan Quayle’s bitter old speechwriter wrinkling her nose about it in the conservative movement’s most high-profile publication?

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  71. Catherine said on September 7, 2008 at 6:34 pm

    Jeff, that was an interesting article. It’s good to know that parts of the religious right are facing the consequences of their politics, and finding a little personal tolerance.

    The issue seems to me to have other facets, though. It’s not quite as simple as “discourage abortion, affirm single motherhood.” If you’re going to discourage abortion, which I think is a worthy goal, then you need to think about what kind of families you’re encouraging.

    If single parent families are likely to happen, there are a host of social costs that go with them. Many of these are just the type of thing the Republican party would like to de-fund.

    Alternatively, if you’d like to encourage two-parent families, which most research shows is better for kids, then you need to teach folks to prevent/plan their pregnancies. Here again, we run into situations where certain members of the Republican party don’t want to fund certain kinds of education.

    So which is it? Are we going to support single parents and resign ourselves to bearing the societal costs? Are we going to provide better sex ed? Are we going to (selectively) embrace pregnant teenage moms? From my standpoint, this is where the hypocrisy comes in.

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  72. brian stouder said on September 7, 2008 at 7:13 pm

    Say, and while we’re talking about abortion, let’s go all the way (so to speak) and review this snippet from the Rick Warren forum (from Reuters):

    Asked at what point a baby gets “human rights,” Obama, who strongly supports abortion rights, said: “… whether you’re looking at it from a theological perspective or a scientific perspective, answering that question with specificity … is above my pay grade.”He went on to reiterate his view that it was important to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies.

    Republican presidential candidate John McCain, who followed Obama onto the stage of the nationally televised event, was more blunt and more emphatic. He said a baby’s human rights began “at the moment of conception … I have a 25-year pro-life record.”

    The general way this is reported is as an Obama error, but –

    is this what we want? Are we electing an Ayatollah in Chief (with a jihadist runningmate who natters on about the war in Iraq as “a task from God”)?

    I agree with Obama 100% – the question about when an unborn being “gets human rights” does not lend itself to a simple black and white answer.

    Do we want a president with a simple snap-answer for every complex question? (THIS is where the “McBush” name comes in)

    For that matter, if (somehow) we could assure that every embryo within every pregnancy “gets human rights” “from the moment of conception”, then who do we investigate/arrest when any pregnancy ends, for any reason? Afterall, mother nature being what it is, pregnancies end all the time, for all sorts of reasons other than abortion.

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  73. Jolene said on September 7, 2008 at 7:17 pm

    More on double standards.

    I hadn’t known, Nancy, that Schiffren was a Quayle speechwriter. Bill Kristol was one of his people too. That must have been quite an operation.

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  74. Julie Robinson said on September 7, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    Here’s a perfect example of what all too sadly can go wrong when babies are not planned/wanted: You can talk all you want about the innocent lives of the unborn, but what about after they are born? This babe was abused all of her short life until finally battered to death. As a mother and a Christian, I don’t see that her life was kept sacred in any way. Abortion is not always the wrong choice.

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  75. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 7, 2008 at 8:12 pm

    Catherine, i’d not waste time parsing hypocrisy and just say i think it’s a little of all you suggest. Yes, including improved sex ed, which (shock! awe!) is not a simple task. Given that i know full well that 85% of parents are not doing squat other than providing access to their own porn for sex ed at hom, this puts non-religious-school conservatives like me in a nice pinch as to what we want in the schools. I probably am fine with more than most of my fellow theo-cons in the classroom, up to and including the fishbowl full of condoms in the nurses office (just don’t put it in the cafeteria, it’s all i ask), and i’ll teach a different line at home and see how it takes.

    Julie, i hear you, i appreciate your sincerity, but i can’t go there. Child abusers should be flogged in the public square (see! i really am a theo-con), and we may need to get a little more real about how as a civil society we let children’s services intervene, but talk about your can of worms (all politicans posture unforgivably on this one, judges included)* — but i’d rather open that can of worms than explain to the Boss someday why i thought killing them in the womb was more merciful. You don’t have to agree with me, i’m just sayin’.

    *and like mental health “asylums” we’re so proud we closed them all, while being blind to the awful compromise that works better for 90% but put 10% in Hades — we could open a few orphanages, or give up the canard that gay/lesbian couples can’t be good foster parents, or just get real about alternative custody arrangements, but we still like to pretend there’s a unicorn farm on the edge of town with cupcakes at every meal where we send the hardest to place kids. Damnation, but the unicorn farm is closed, all the bunnies had rabies, and we are out of cupcakes. Gotta get real about where those children go, and that’s not in the debate much.

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  76. moe99 said on September 7, 2008 at 8:49 pm

    the mental asylums were closed on Reagan’s watch. Another one for the hypocrites.

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  77. nancy said on September 7, 2008 at 8:56 pm

    That’s one of those things where there’s plenty of blame to go around, Moe. The civil-rights-for-mentally-ill crowd dovetailed with the no-new-spending gang, and their worst influences meshed perfectly. Deinstitutionalization would have worked with more community support and mental-health centers, and that, alas, wasn’t forthcoming in the age of tax cuts and no-new-spending.

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  78. MaryC said on September 7, 2008 at 9:15 pm

    And yet, somehow, this teen pregnancy and shotgun wedding is OK?

    I know it’s been said over and over but I’m going to say it again (just because I’m so gob-smacked by this):

    Can you imagine the reaction from Republicans if the Obamas had a pregnant unmarried 17-year-old daughter and they invited the teenage, tattooed, high-school dropout father of the child up on stage with her at the DNC? Heads would explode.

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  79. basset said on September 7, 2008 at 9:19 pm

    I am declaring personal election overload at this time. overall two hundred percent tired of it, here and everywhere… way too much “you’re wrong, I’m right, shut up, I’m not listening” going around.

    I mean, look at this… Nancy puts up a picture of an (expletive deleted) cabbage, first response comes at 1:46, someone finds a way to connect it to the election at 4:31, discussion goes back and forth between election-related and food a few times, at 7:51 someone takes off on Sarah Palin banning books and heeeeere we go again, drowning in election static with food posts sticking their little heads up now and then.

    guess we should be happy that the thread went six whole hours and a little more before someone got the same old argument going again.

    anyone got anything else to talk about? more cabbage recipes, maybe? we made Indiana-style tenderloins for dinner tonight, here in Tennessee they don’t even know what those are…

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  80. jcburns said on September 7, 2008 at 9:40 pm

    I am declaring personal cabbage overload at this time. Phew-weee!

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  81. MaryC said on September 7, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    personal cabbage overload

    Me too. Coleslaw — OK. If there’s enough mayo.

    But cooked? What jcburns said.

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  82. MichaelG said on September 7, 2008 at 10:49 pm

    “Indiana-style tenderloins”. For sure I don’t know what that is. I’d be happy to try some though.

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  83. Jeff (the mild-mannered one) said on September 7, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    The worst thing about the end of county fair season is that you can’t find the platter-size tenderloins with fresh onion and tomato and just the right amount of mayo anymore.

    Except at Aladdin’s in Granville OH! Come to Licking County and feast on tenderloins, Hoosier-style in the Buckeye State. The greasiest spoon in the Midwest not adjoining an interstate . . .

    (h/t Basset!)

    ps — Indiana style sez to me “pounded flat until they’re too big to fit on any bun known to bakerdom.”

    pps — the Great Society, God bless ’em, started de-institutionalization, so it’s a Johnson-Nixon-Ford-Carter-Reagan clusterclosing. Bipartisan stupid; you can look it up.

    pps — IMHO, the best coleslaw is not mayo based. But hey, i like German Potato Salad, hot and vinegary (the better to go with Shiner Bock!).

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  84. basset said on September 8, 2008 at 7:53 am

    h/t meaning, of course, Herald-Telephone… the name of the Bloomington paper before it merged with the Bedford paper and became the Herald-Times.

    Wikipedia’s description of the tenderloin: “As with all quadrupeds, the tenderloin refers to the Psoas major muscle along the central spine portion, which more or less hangs between the shoulder blade and hip socket. This is the most tender part of the animal, because the muscles that support the inner organs are not used for locomotion.”

    so Indiana-style would mean fat, conservative, and not helping any as the rest of the body waddles into Wal-Mart, I would guess… but what I had in mind was more like this:

    (anyone know how to insert links in Firefox so I don’t have to show the whole address next time? “help” is no help, thanks)

    traditional presentation involves yellow mustard and pickle chips rather than lettuce, tomato, & mayo, your mileage may vary.

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  85. MichaelG said on September 8, 2008 at 8:47 am

    You bread beef tenderloin at $15 a pound, deep fry it, put mustard, catsup, mayo, pickles and tomato on it? And eat it?

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  86. MichaelG said on September 8, 2008 at 8:48 am

    Or pork.

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  87. nancy said on September 8, 2008 at 9:02 am

    Yes, Michael, that’s what they do with it. Only first they pound it until it’s the dimension of a hubcap, a way to maximize the breading acreage.

    You fagz in Cali think you’ve got pork tenderloin figured out, what with your grills and fancy lime-and-pepper marinades, but you’re just…dare I say? I will: Elitist.

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  88. LAMary said on September 8, 2008 at 11:25 am

    I don’t care if anyone’s overloaded on cabbage. I wasn’t here yesterday so I have to put in my two cents.
    I like both creamy and vinegary coleslaw. The current house favorite is sort of creamy with home made mayo, dijon mustard and very appley cider vinegar. I like the vinegary kind if it has cumin in it.
    I make cabbage similar to MichaelG’s when I make roast pork. Cabbage, pork, roasted squash and potatoes is pretty much the supper for the first coolish day of fall, which here means some time in November.
    That book list is the one someone told me about, and you’re right about the dates. It must be bogus. However, I do think it’s the list of books that some group has been trying to ban. for a few years. Other than the dates, I doubt Sarah Palin is famliar with all the titles on that list. She’s not stupid, but she does not strike me as a reader.

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  89. nancy said on September 8, 2008 at 11:35 am

    That’s the stock master list of books that someone, somewhere, has tried to ban. I wish people wouldn’t be so stupid about these things (nothing personal, Moe); the minute I saw that e-mail I knew it was bogus, and propagating it is doing Rove’s work for him. Book-banners don’t sweep into office and just hand a librarian a list like that. It always starts with concern for “the children” or some other bullshit. It’s always incremental.

    If I still had my scanner, I’d get out my Shel Silverstein books and display the pages that a Hoosier member of the American Family Association told me had secret subliminal pro-gay and -bestiality messages.

    In the meantime, let’s strive for a little less credulity. These people have done enough to be concerned about without having to embroider.

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  90. LAMary said on September 8, 2008 at 11:55 am

    I remember seeing some daytime talk show in the mid eighties, the sort that usually did not take on any sort of controversy, just recipes and people promoting their books and movies. One day female co-host type says they’re going to interview a local librarian about childrens’ books in her library about the occult. They talked about books with witches and magic in them. This hostess kept on the librarian why she insisted on keeping books about the black arts in the library where children could have access to them. She mentiones Hansel and Gretel, Strega Nonna, books about King Arthur and Merlin. Occult?

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