There are a lot of special events – attractions – that happen through the year. I’m not into most of them, but that’s fine, not everything is for everyone. Air shows are a particular who-gives-a-crap thing; I mean, stand around craning your neck all day to watch planes fly overhead? For others, maybe, but not for me.
Then, Sunday, this happened not far down the road:
A MiG-23 fighter jet crashed today at the Willow Run Airport of Thunder air show in Michigan. The two pilots reportedly ejected and are both unharmed
— Flight Emergency (@FlightEmergency) August 13, 2023
That’s a Russian MiG-23, part of the Thunder Over Michigan air show near Ypsi, and it did a big ol’ oopsie into an apartment complex parking lot. The pilots ejected safely, and the plane, amazingly, hit only parked cars when it came down.
It’s the ejections that always amaze me. I recall, from “The Right Stuff,” that ejection is incredibly dangerous. Pilots are basically igniting an explosive under their seats, and all kinds of bad things can happen on the way out. Isn’t this how Goose died in “Top Gun,” in fact? Hit his head on the canopy as he was launched into the wild blue yonder? But if the choice is between Maybe Dying and Definitely Dying, of course anyone would choose door no. 1. Still. Freaky.
Anyway, one more piece of Russian hardware gone for good. Sorry, Vlad. Maybe your tech just isn’t what it could be. Or pilot error, who knows.
So much news these past few days. Maui on fire. Trump on fire (in the pants region, anyway). Rodriguez dead. Ohio’s Issue 1, buh-bye. And this bullshit in Kansas. I haven’t been able to keep up, at least not here, but I trust you all have been able to.
This will return to normal soon. For now, watch the plane crash.
FDChief said on August 13, 2023 at 10:34 pm
Maybe it’s the season…but the sports channel ESPN2 has been showing all kinds of goofy “sports”; paper airplane throwing. Beer stein holding. Sign spinning (think “minimum wage guy with Little Caesar sign on the corner”). Corgi racing.
The best part is they call this “The Ocho”, which you get if you’ve seen that dodgeball comedy.
Any and all are more entertaining than your basic air show. Well, okay, the sign thing was lame.
But I’ve never got the idea of standing out in the sun to watch other people fry stuff, including the weird thing where people drive out to watch airplanes fly around Portland Airport…
638 chars
Joe Kobiela said on August 13, 2023 at 10:52 pm
Possibly a bird ingested into the engine is what I have heard. It was a civilian owned Mig23, and yes ejecting is violent usually back injuries or broken arms or legs. Goose hit the canopy because they were in a flat spin and didn’t have enough forward momentum to get away from the canopy.
Pilot Joe
301 chars
Deborah said on August 13, 2023 at 10:53 pm
I have this theory that people go to those airshows honestly to observe those kind of catastrophes. Because it’s always kind of possible, isn’t it? The air and water show in Chicago over the lakefront is something I’m always glad I’m not there for anymore. Sure it was exciting the first time I saw it but our cats were terrified and so was I mostly.
We are officially done with the pet/house sit in Abiquiu, thank god. my saintly husband picked up the owner neighbors at the airport and drove them back to their house, it was over a 200 mile drive for him. I think the neighbors think they did us a favor by letting us shower at their house while we were at our cabin, or whatever. It was ridiculously hard work, the dog is emotionally damaged and required a lot of attention, he was terrified of the wind, which is constant there and lordy, dog hair everywhere all the time. I vacuumed every other day to try to keep up with it. Plus the ants and the filth in the house. We didn’t actually see any mice, again thank god, but I know they were there. I spent about 6 hours cleaning the last day because I wanted to leave it as spotless as possible. They were happy to be home and they don’t have a clue how much work we put in. They thought we were using their hot tub every night, but we only did for about 3 nights of the whole month. It was such a pain in the ass to set up to use because of the ramshackle way they maintained it. It wasn’t that hot which to be honest was probably a good thing because the temps were so high outside most of the time anyway. While the long view while in the hot tub was pretty spectacular, you had to look at all the crap around their house before you could see it. They had tools and boxes of empty wine bottles and this and that propped up here and there it wasn’t a pleasant setting to relax in. They have a cat too, which was super easy to care for, just feeding and scooping and changing the litter, she wasn’t a problem that way, but LB and my husband’s allergies were pretty horrendous because it was so hot the windows had to be closed for the AC most of the time. Which was why I was vacuuming every other day for their sakes. We bought a super thick, large dog bed for the arthritic dog to see if that would calm him down at night. They didn’t mention a word about it when my husband dropped them off back at their house yesterday. I don’t know if they even remembered it wasn’t there before, like they thought it was something they had all along. We brushed the dog multiple times a day and as I said before I’m surprised the dog wasn’t bald by the time we were done. My husband ended up doing the last week by himself there because LB and I had had it after 4 weeks even though we got breaks in between here and there. Oh and did I mention we were expected to water their sad “garden” with horribly heavy hoses that kinked all of the time so you constantly had to go around and shake the kinks out which in all the dirt and dust made you filthy. Plus it was so hot and the unforgiving sun around the place which had zero shade made no sense what-so-ever to try to grow anything except what might naturally grow, which really was nothing. It was such a waste of aquifer well water it made me furious. That and feeding the birds which mostly fed the mice and rats. We don’t feed the birds in Abiquiu, because they’re out in the wild and need to fend for themselves. It’s different in Santa Fe, because we humans are encroaching on the territory of the birds and need to make up for that. One of these days I’ll stop complaining about this experience. Rant over.
3642 chars
basset said on August 13, 2023 at 11:06 pm
Well, on a happier note, Mrs. B and I helped with another rescue dog run this weekend… an English setter from New Orleans to Wapakoneta, Ohio, that destination being why I mention it here.
This was one of those drive awhile and pass him on situations, with handoffs along the way in Slidell, Hattiesburg, Meridian, Tuscaloosa, Birmingham, Decatur, Columbia, Nashville, and Bowling Green just on the first day.
He spent the night in BG, rode up through Elizabethtown, Louisville, Walton and Dayton to his forever home about midday today. Mrs. B likes these runs to Bowling Green because there’s a Meijer there, southernmost one we know of.
651 chars
alex said on August 14, 2023 at 12:14 am
The Chicago Air & Water Show is a disaster waiting to happen, and I’m glad not to be living under it anymore. Why is anyone still willing to insure it? I guess some colliding fighter jet formation will have to take out a hi-rise or three before anyone decides maybe this isn’t such a good idea.
298 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 14, 2023 at 3:18 am
“Searching for Sugar Man” is an unforgettable documentary.
The Sixto Rodriguez saga is amazing. Every now and then a gentle soul is cast into the spotlight; Rodriguez handled the fame wonderfully. “Sugar Man” is a great tune.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E90_aL870ao
271 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 14, 2023 at 3:26 am
First African concert: Rodriguez
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e70oln-7evM&t=25s
88 chars
Jim said on August 14, 2023 at 5:37 am
The pilots onboard bailed out, the plane blew, and it didn’t blow up (to destroy any evidence) until a few seconds AFTER it crash landed .
140 chars
David C said on August 14, 2023 at 5:57 am
Our airshow ended a couple of weeks ago. Four crashes, two fatal, four dead. Fortunately, one went down on the airport grounds and one into Lake Winnebago. One of these years, something’s going to come down in the city and the party will be over or at least big changes will need to be made. It brings 300,000 people into the city, they say, so it’s like Christmas in July for the local businesses.
398 chars
Dorothy said on August 14, 2023 at 8:32 am
It’s beyond me why anyone would want to go to an air show and potentially watch their impending death come spiraling toward themselves, a place they CHOSE to attend and willingly forked over money to attend. This is not a commentary on the abilities of pilots, planes in general, etc. Just me trying to express my amazement about people who want to go to airshows.
Being a former Pittsburgher I was sad to see the story about the house that exploded, destroying it and others near it, and the lives lost in Plum Borough. I know two families who live there. My friend Toni is one of them – I just saw her not long ago for her mother’s memorial service. The other is a former friend, Marilyn, who lost her mind and went full MAGA Trumper in 2016 so I don’t communicate with her anymore. Both Toni and Marilyn live about 3.5 miles from where the explosion happened on Saturday. I checked because I wanted to know if they might have been impacted by the explosion. When we lived in Liberty Township (north of Cincinnati) for 2.5 years a house just down the street and around the corner from us exploded but not as bad as the one this weekend in Plum. No one was hurt in that explosion. The family was backing out of their driveway to go to church and as they closed the garage door, the explosion happened. Their dog ran out and was wandering for a day or so but came back and was not hurt badly. They rebuilt on the same lot.
Basset we used to own a dog that was half English setter and half Golden Retriever. Best dog we ever had, Atticus. His sire was an old retriever, and the dam was the setter, only about a year old herself. The owner said she didn’t realize she was in heat for the first time until her kids came in the house, loudly announcing “MOM – Lacey is dancing with Chester!!” That was back in 1996, I think, when we adopted Atticus. I hope the one you escorted found a wonderful new home.
1907 chars
JodiP said on August 14, 2023 at 8:59 am
I loved our rescued pets. Our dog is a pretty nervous guy, and we have to keep him leashed when visitors are here. Yesterday he was so chill on the couch between me and our friends as we watched “Everything Everywhere All at Once.” Our friend spend quite a bit of time giving him scritches. When they got up to leave, woo boy, growling, trying to get at them. We all know the drill, so it’s OK.
Luckily, when we’ve had to have pet sitters, when new they come over spend time with him. When they come into the house at the beginning of the sit, he’s cool after some barking. He loves one of them especially–he always cuddles with her.
Deborah, I hope you never sit for those people again. For our sitters we clean like we’re expecting guests–they stay overnight, so sheets get washed etc.
795 chars
Jason T. said on August 14, 2023 at 10:10 am
I have to admit, that’s a pretty spectacular stunt at the Ypsilanti air show. But what do they do for an encore?
112 chars
Mark P said on August 14, 2023 at 10:34 am
In our experience, good pet sitters are worth their weight in gold, especially if they need to spend the night. These days I don’t think my wife will ever go on an overnight trip, so it’s academic. I may have some eye surgery coming up, so I’ll probably have to board our two dogs. My wife can’t handle one of them.
I love the old WW II war birds, but I think it’s a crime to actually fly them. There are very few left, and every crash is one less irreplaceable historic artifact.
491 chars
basset said on August 14, 2023 at 10:59 am
Golden and English cross, what a calm and happy dog he must have been.
Couple of texts from the rescue dog’s “forever” family:
❤️ to “ We have our Riley boy!!!!!! Thank you to everyone who has been a part of his coming to his furever home. Love you all❤️ ”
We are home. Introductions are going well. Bentley, our greyhound was easey peasy. Our shepherd is all up his butt and Riley isn’t too sure of that. Will take time for everyone to get accustomed to each other.
*******************
That plane, btw, was a Vietnam-era Soviet fighter and the only privately owned Mig-23 in the entire world. We got to see some WW2 warbirds fly when we were in England this past spring, went to Duxford museum and saw two Spitfires, a Corsair, and a Tiger Moth in the air. You can buy a Spitfire ride there, something around $3000 if I remember right, or pay a lot less to sit in a static display Spitfire on the ground and, I dunno, make vroom-vroom noises for fifteen minutes.
990 chars
JodiP said on August 14, 2023 at 11:21 am
bassett, thanks for the update! Glad things are going well so far.
66 chars
Deborah said on August 14, 2023 at 12:12 pm
Our neighbor’s dog is a rescue, they’ve had him about 5 years, I think. He’s maybe 10 years old. We think he had a very stressful early life, so he’s very emotional a lot of the time, can’t blame him really. He’s sweet but very needy, makes a lot of noise through the night. I’m sure part of his neediness was the fact that his owners were gone and he was confused and missed them. We only took him outside on leash because we had no idea if he’d try to run away or if wild animals came around like coyotes or even bears that he’d pick a fight. There was a bear siting in the area a few days before the petsit was to start. I tried to get bear mace but couldn’t find it. We will never sit for these people again, but they are friends. It’s amazing what you find out about people when you spend time in their homes. As I’ve said before we’ve had dinner at their place many times, but the lights were usually low and I guess they cleaned up before we got there, so had no idea it was so dirty.
991 chars
FDChief said on August 14, 2023 at 12:26 pm
The huge 12-cylinder engines used in the last of the prop-driven fighters make a pretty impressive vroom, tbh.
Years ago I was visiting some friends in Richland, Washington during the annual hydroplane racing. All but one boat ran on turbines, but that odd-boat-out was powered by a WW2-era Griffon engine, and holy Hell was it loud. Earsplitting, even from our half-mile-away vantage point…
395 chars
susan said on August 14, 2023 at 12:44 pm
I’ve heard that Liberty engines have been used in hydroplanes that race, too. THOSE are super loud, and very heavy, so that’s odd.
130 chars
Mark P said on August 14, 2023 at 12:44 pm
About 50 years ago I found one of the B-25’s used in the Catch 22 movie. It was at a small airport where I could walk around freely. It had a placard on the landing gear that gave its history and the cost per hour to fly it. I don’t remember the number, but it was probably in the $200 range. That’s more than $1400 in today’s money.
342 chars
basset said on August 14, 2023 at 12:46 pm
Saw the big hydroplanes run at Evansville years ago, iirc some of em had 12-cylinder GM Allison engines similar to what was used in the P-51, P-38, and others.
159 chars
Deborah said on August 14, 2023 at 12:46 pm
I should have said bear sighting, not bear siting.
50 chars
Jason T. said on August 14, 2023 at 1:08 pm
Deborah, bear siting is very important. It’s always a good idea to plan where you’re going to put your bears.
I hope your friends in the Plum area are OK. The devastation seems to be confined to that neighborhood, but it looks like a bomb went off, or the aftermath of a tornado. There’s security camera footage of the initial blast and it’s like an explosion in a Hollywood movie.
Still no word on the cause. The working theory is a natural gas explosion; there were unconfirmed reports that one of the basements was full of guns and ammunition, and several neighbors reported hearing rounds exploding as the fire burned. They’re using DNA to identify some of the victims. It’s awful.
687 chars
brian stouder said on August 14, 2023 at 1:51 pm
Deborah, I stand corrected; I thought you were indicating that there was a bear shitting (as in the old saying ‘Does a bear shit in the woods?’), which I suppose would be, in any case, a distinction without a difference!!
225 chars
Dorothy said on August 14, 2023 at 2:22 pm
Jason my friends live far enough away that I doubt they even heard the explosion(s), let alone be impacted by it. I haven’t spoken with Toni at all since I saw her at her mother’s service in June.
Speaking of identifying victims, we had NBC Nightly News on last night and one of the officials in Lahaina spoke very movingly about the bodies they are finding in cars or at the homes that burned. And his voice cracked as he said something about searchers picking up bodies, but they’re falling apart as they pick them up because of how badly burned they are. There’s NOTHING to identify – the man looked like he was in shock while he was talking and I’m not the least bit surprised that he is. To think that (as of last night) only 3% of the burnt areas have been searched yet!
790 chars
Brandon said on August 14, 2023 at 3:21 pm
It’s the ejections that always amaze me.
In G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero, G.I. Joe and Cobra would engage in laser dogfights. Whenever an aircraft was shot down the pilot was always shown ejecting from it.
This, for example. (About 2:30 in).
344 chars
Julie Robinson said on August 14, 2023 at 3:27 pm
It’s heartbreaking to watch the footage from Hawaii night after night, and to know the trauma both families and responders are experiencing. We have some family and a friend there, all far away from the damaged area. I’ll note that World Central Kitchen has been there from almost the start, serving up food to anyone who is hungry. https://wck.org/relief/hawaii-wildfires-2023
basset and Mrs b, thanks for driving the lucky pupper to his new home. Hope she got in some good Meijer shopping!
Saturday night our daughter took her dog out and encountered three dogs on the run. She got the little guy but the other two had already taken off. When she brought him/her in we pawed through the thick fur to discover no collar. She put him/her down in front of the water dish and I pulled out some food, but doggo wouldn’t eat or drink, just wanted out. Plus her own dog was barking and chasing after the new dog (chiweenie, very insecure). Little dog was passive and didn’t bark at all or fight back, just wanted out to go home.
After posting the dog’s picture on social media, Sarah put it on her own harness and leash, thinking if she took it outside it might lead her back to the house. Someone saw the pic, called her, and we got it back. Not sure about the other two dogs, because it was a bad situation.
Situation: neighbor has friends and their three dogs over and also invites grandma to dogsit them, then they all leave. Grandma lets the dogs out in the (unfenced) back yard and goes back into the house. “They always stay in the back yard”. Except when they don’t.
None of the dogs was wearing a collar, it was already dark and they were running across streets, grandma is not a competent dog sitter, this little guy’s fur was matted and dirty, maybe they shouldn’t have pets if this is how they “care” for them. Etc, etc, etc.
I saw her firing texts off to the neighbors and her face told me she was giving it to them.
1942 chars
David C said on August 14, 2023 at 5:18 pm
Any Republican who asks why President Biden isn’t in Hawaii needs to be punched in the face, and of course they are. What do they think he should do, throw paper towels at them?
177 chars
LAMary said on August 14, 2023 at 6:13 pm
Older son Tom just finished a month long dog and chicken sitting gig. He also tended to the bee hives. He’s been house and dog and other animals and children sitting since his teens. He’s in demand. Coincidentally he’s getting a ride in a WW2 vintage plane at an air show here too. The owner is the son of the cool old guy same son drives around town. Multitasking: chicken, bee and dog sitting while driving old JPL guys around and getting rewarded for it with a ride in an old airplane.
He’s also rehearsing to play the mandolin at a church performing I’ll Fly Away and some other traditional African American church songs. He’s a renaissance man, that lad.
662 chars
Sherri said on August 14, 2023 at 9:05 pm
JPL has never gotten the attention it deserves. The early work in rocketry done by the JPL founders has been memory-holed because they were inconvenient people. Frank Malina ended up leaving the US because he had been involved with communists at Caltech. Qian Xuesen was deported to China for the same reason, even though there was no evidence he ever spied or shared information with China. Jack Parsons was sidelined even by the other two, who were also co-founders of Aerojet with him, because of his weird involvement with Aleister Crowley’s cult.
So, they were strange, but instead we turned out rocket program over to Nazis because at least they weren’t communists.
679 chars
alex said on August 14, 2023 at 10:24 pm
Any Republican who asks why President Biden isn’t in Hawaii needs to be punched in the face, and of course they are. What do they think he should do, throw paper towels at them?
They’re being patronized just fine by Oprah. Prolly would rather see her anyway.
270 chars
Brandon said on August 15, 2023 at 1:41 am
Presidents come and go, but there’s always Oprah.
TMZ: Maui Officials Clarify Reports Oprah Winfrey Denied Entry into Maui Shelter.
264 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 15, 2023 at 9:01 am
I was just surfing YouTube and up popped a concert in The Netherlands by Rodriguez, and I watched the whole thing. He was rather feeble and walked to the mic with an assistant steadying him, and he appeared to be nearly blind as he needed frequent assistance in his stool/chair between songs. He was in good spirits however, singing cover songs and also “Sugar Man”, with a post-disclaimer that the song was “not prescriptive, but descriptive”.
What a life story.
This day laborer from Detroit ended up with a $5 million bank account. Life is strange, none stranger than Rodriguez’s life.
596 chars
Jason T. said on August 15, 2023 at 9:58 am
Dorothy, I’m sorry I mixed you up with Deborah. Sign me, Confused in … where am I again?
Speculation on the Plum, Pa., explosion is now focused on a malfunctioning hot-water tank: https://triblive.com/local/valley-news-dispatch/hot-water-tank-a-focus-of-fire-marshals-investigation-into-plum-house-explosion/
313 chars
Heather said on August 15, 2023 at 11:08 am
Can’t believe no one’s commented on Trump & Co.’s RICO indictment in GA yet. As someone wrote on Twitter, “I still have my third indictment decorations up!”
160 chars
FDChief said on August 15, 2023 at 11:53 am
Heather: I guess my reply would be “what hasn’t already been said?”
We all saw them criming. It was on live TV and everything. They’ve openly admitted what that did – and that they’ll do it again if they can.
And none of that matters to the 45% of the US “citizens” who are more afraid of a Cambodian ladyboy in a cocktail frock than a criminal dictator-wannabe Chief Executive.
The first three didn’t change any of that. How will this? We now live in a “republic” where 70+ million people will vote for an openly corrupt criminal-mob boss to rule that republic. At least Caesar had the decency to use honest force.
And speaking of Romans…I just realized that the heading of this post implies that the air show crash was an attempt to read the will of the gods (an “augury”) rather than simply screwing the aircraft into the ground (to “auger in”). Who knew?
900 chars
Little Bird said on August 15, 2023 at 12:03 pm
I’m currently dog sitting again, three dogs this time. This house is in the city proper, so I can still go to the store or see a friend. It’s nice and cool in this house (built in swamp cooler) and the yards are walled in so I can let the dogs out without having to leash them.
The only drawbacks are that there are 91 houseplants here and various different lights keep turning on in the kids room. And the kids door keeps opening by itself. It’s an old Stamm house so I imagined that it could settle oddly when the day cools off. And the dogs could be opening the door looking for the kids. None of the dogs act particularly odd so I don’t think there’s a reason to get really concerned (though one of them sat and whined at the linen closet door for awhile when my friend was doing the dog sitting here a few weeks ago).
All the dogs are rescues, and all of them are actually well behaved. I just really need to up my prices when it comes to three dogs.
976 chars
Brandon said on August 15, 2023 at 3:08 pm
Can’t believe no one’s commented on Trump & Co.’s RICO indictment in GA yet.
No one here has discussed the allegations against Lizzo either. Say what you like about Madonna, but she has never treated her dancers like that. However, she was sued by three of her dancers in 1992 for "invasion of privacy …".
429 chars
Mark P said on August 15, 2023 at 3:27 pm
I’m hearing now that Trump’s lawyers are going to try to get the Georgia charges tried in federal court. So, at best, long delays as the motion works its way to the Supreme Court. At this point, I am not optimistic. It wasn’t that long ago that I believed you were more likely to get justice in federal court than in a Georgia state court. I’m afraid it’s the opposite now, at least for a Fulton County court.
419 chars
Jeff Borden said on August 15, 2023 at 5:01 pm
Ironic the party (allegedly) of law and order now works feverishly to destroy the rule of law.
94 chars
David C said on August 15, 2023 at 5:22 pm
Rule of law is for “those” people.
34 chars
Jeff Borden said on August 15, 2023 at 6:12 pm
Is it possible tRump will skate on this? It seems entirely possible. There are videos. There are tapes. There are emails. There are texts. There are eyewitnesses. The entire nation saw our Capitol building defiled by traitorous scum while tRump enjoyed the spectacle on TV and waited hours to intervene. And still…I have these horrible feelings that the corrupt, traitorous, immoral an evil bastard will not pay a price. And if that happens, what will we do?
460 chars
David C said on August 15, 2023 at 6:38 pm
And if that happens, what will we do?
If it happens, chop wood, carry water. If it doesn’t happen, chop wood, carry water. Either way, there’s still a lot of work to be done.
184 chars
LAMary said on August 15, 2023 at 7:54 pm
When the lads were younger we did the JPL open house every spring. It was fascinating and the employees giving the tours were enthusiastic and patient with all questions. Especially talking to kids. I Loved those JPL tours. I never got tired of seeing the Mars rover or the room where all everyone sat to watch missions.
320 chars
alex said on August 15, 2023 at 10:38 pm
Can’t believe no one has commented on the Georgia indictments yet?
I think we’ve all become so inured to the cray-cray that we don’t know what to think or say about any of it. I’m amazed that the only Trumpers who dare to open their mouths about it are anonymous commenters on blogs and news web sites or Republicans surveyed by pollsters (or craven pussy pols like Gym Jordan and Lady G), but the usual suspects in my neck of the woods don’t say a damned thing, at least not in front of me.
I haven’t given up hope that the system works and that Captain Combover is gonna get his just deserts in both federal and state courts and that his most fervent supporters are going to pretend that they never got had like they did and change the subject when it’s brought up like they do when it’s about their time share in Fort Myers Beach.
840 chars
Deborah said on August 15, 2023 at 11:30 pm
Alex, what is there left to say about it? It’s all so outrageously mind blowingly wrong. And those words don’t in anyway describe it, that it leaves one unable to begin to comment. I’m at a loss to put into words what I think or feel about it all… what can I say?
272 chars
Brandon said on August 16, 2023 at 1:57 am
I just realized Madonna turns 65 tomorrow. And she’s inspiring a whole new generation.
178 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 16, 2023 at 8:02 am
Peter Baker of The New York Times reports that behind the scenes there already is planning taking place to invoke the 25th amendment if Trump wins , if he is convicted at any point, should he win in 2024, from a prison cell, house arrest, or allowed to be President in The White House.
No one would deserve that disgrace more than he would, or maybe shall. Nixon had the decency to jump on that Marine One chopper and fly away.
This fucker we are dealing with will/would never resign.
488 chars
jcburns said on August 16, 2023 at 8:30 am
Just a reminder to those scoring at home: the President is a guy named Joe Biden. Vice-president: Kamala Harris.
And: Biden, Harris and their team are working hard on all kinds of issues.
I’m sure glad they are.
217 chars
Suzanne said on August 16, 2023 at 9:45 am
I’m sure he meant well
https://religionnews.com/2023/08/15/pastor-indicted-alongside-trump-in-georgia-election-meddling-case/
130 chars
FDChief said on August 16, 2023 at 10:09 am
Jeff: at this point “what will we do?” is immaterial. Whether Trump skates or dies in prison, the dictatorial genie is out of the bottle; “If Sulla can do it, why can’t I?”
Trump is our latter-day Sulla; showing in bold relief the sham the republic has become as some set of the “citizens” prefer to rule by force if they cannot by vote.
(Didn’t Elmo tweet something about how the modern US “needs a Sulla”? The fascists don’t even pretend anymore…)
It’s too late to do anything but decide whether to fight these criminals to the last ditch or accept the end of the American Experiment as the Romans accepted the caesars.
657 chars
LAMary said on August 16, 2023 at 10:12 am
Think he’s trying to get the Georgia stuff moved to federal court because he can’t give himself a pardon for a state case?
122 chars
jcburns said on August 16, 2023 at 10:34 am
@LAMary: Yes, for sure.
@FDChief: I’d like to believe there will be a moment in this judicial process where Trump has a flash of awareness that what he did was wrong, and now, well.
I’d LIKE to believe that.
213 chars
David C said on August 16, 2023 at 10:56 am
Even if the Fulton County case is moved to Federal Court, I’ve heard the case would still be tried under Georgia law so he still couldn’t be pardoned.
152 chars
Dorothy said on August 16, 2023 at 11:04 am
I also read somewhere that the governor of Georgia could pardon him, but I don’t see that happening. I’m no Pollyanna but I strongly believe that right is going to win eventually, and we will never have another four years of that asswipe. Thanks, Dexter, for that info about the 25th amendment possibility. It gives me peace of mind that people are already thinking that far ahead. My head hurts from thinking too much about all of this since Monday night. I need to shut off the television and put on music and knit, or read, or quilt.
540 chars
Pam said on August 16, 2023 at 11:58 am
Regarding that ejection from the plane, aren’t pilots supposed to ensure that their plane won’t crash/kill anyone on the ground? Or at least to try to drop the plane in a lake or something. Does that only happen in movies? I think it’s amazing that no one on the ground was killed. So did the pilots make a decision to save themselves first and the possible ground victims are on their own? I don’t know anything about flying a plane, but it DID crash into the parking lot of an apartment building and it could easily have been the building.
546 chars
jcburns said on August 16, 2023 at 1:49 pm
@Dorothy: the governor of our state—Georgia—cannot pardon him, or any random klansman. Can NOT.
Whoo hoo!
112 chars
Joe Kobiela said on August 16, 2023 at 1:50 pm
Pam,
If you’re driving your car down the road and a tanker truck pulls out in front of you, do you hit it or do you swerve thru a playground full of kids? Survival instincts are strong, I would like to think the pilots looked at his options first and did the best he could before punching out.
Who among us can say they would sacrifice their life? I honestly can’t say I would but who knows till your put in that situation.
Pilot Joe
444 chars
Jeff Gill said on August 16, 2023 at 2:38 pm
Swiped from the social media site which shall not be named:
“Crowd-sourcing a decision here: considering a hire whose background check revealed court cases pending in multiple states. He says he’s the victim here, but 91 separate charges seems like it might be a distraction to our mission. Should I overlook the charges and hire him anyway?”
345 chars
Sherri said on August 16, 2023 at 3:19 pm
I’ve been thinking more about polarization, and why I think trying to solve polarization is a waste of time.
The polarization we have today has always been with us. Prior to the 60s and the civil rights movement, it just was less obvious, because it didn’t match up with the political parties. In other words, there were members of both parties on both sides of the polarization, which is about whether we are a multiracial democracy or a democracy for white Christian men. The civil rights movement forced a choice, and Democrats broadly chose a multiracial democracy and Republicans broadly chose white Christian male democracy. So, the polarization became obvious, and it became harder to work across the aisle, because there were no longer ideological allies on the other side.
The people who want to solve polarization by talking across the divide are ignoring what caused polarization. They are primarily white men, nostalgic for a time when bipartisanship occurred because there were people with shared values in the two parties, and oblivious to the fact that only white men were in the conversation.
It is because we trying to expand the conversation beyond white men that polarization happened. It didn’t happen because the people who don’t want it just need to be educated about it; they just don’t want it. There’s no a magic message we can deliver that will make it palatable to them. I’m not saying they can never adjust to a multiracial democracy, because I believe they can, but they will never willingly seek it. Hell, many of the people who support a multiracial democracy balk when they realize that it means giving up a degree of power or status personally.
Polarization is a result, not a cause, of our differences. The fundamental question is, who is allowed to be a real American, with full humanity and rights? If some group wants to engage people on that, and bring people of color to the conversation , then I’m interested.
1979 chars
David C said on August 16, 2023 at 6:05 pm
That’s called the trolley problem, Joe. You paraphrased it pretty well. It’s a common thought experiment in ethics and psychology. Like you say, nobody knows how they’ll react in real life. We all hope we would do the best for the most people but making rational snap decisions isn’t a skill most human possess. We usually give up and shut down.
345 chars
FDChief said on August 16, 2023 at 7:08 pm
jcburns: the central issue – with Tubby and his minions and cultists – is that, no; they don’t have a “are we the baddies?” moment. Ever.
As good cis het white Christian(ist) conservatives whatever they do IS good and right. Because they did it! Duh! If it serves their interests it MUST be good, because they are Good.
That’s why – as Sherri goes into in depth above – there’s no reaching them. Arguing that they’re doing harm, doing wrong, makes no more sense to them than if you were speaking Finnish. To them it’s just meaningless mouth noise.
To a real wingnut, hounding a transgender person to suicide isn’t wrong; it’s their having to see a transgender person that is the wrong. They’re just righting the REAL wrong by ridding God’s Earth of an abomination.
How do you reason with that?
So no. These people won’t have a moment’s hesitation, any more than the Hitlerjugend did in the last ditch outside the Tiergarten. Which is why any of us who loathe their politics can’t pretend we can talk them into surrendering.
It’s direct-fire artillery that’s needed to bury them in their holes.
1143 chars
Deborah said on August 16, 2023 at 7:36 pm
Suzanne, the pastor is Missouri Synod Lutheran, ha ha ha. The LCMS tried to distance themselves from him, but he is theirs.
There is no reasoning with the right wing, it’s a waste of time. The stochastic terrorism that is going on is frightening, the Fulton County grand jury folks have been doxxed by them now. I certainly hope they can be safe along with the judges, prosecutors, witnesses and trial juries in all of the cases. It’s scary, but that’s what the Trumpers are hoping for.
489 chars
jcburns said on August 16, 2023 at 10:20 pm
I just want to say to y’all:
The Fulton County JAIL, down off of Rice, that place is…a piece of work. That will be an experience for all of these folks.
157 chars
Deborah said on August 16, 2023 at 11:40 pm
As I’ve mentioned here before John Eastman lives in Santa Fe. There have been a few protestors that for the last 13 months have been standing outside his subdivision holding up signs about how Eastman needs to be indicted. We have driven by there many times and they’ve been out there every time we passed. They weren’t out in front of his house, only on a more busy road outside of the subdivision where he lives. Now that he’s been indicted they are done protesting at least until they see what happens to him, if he’s convicted etc. I saw him at Target once and really wanted to say something but I held my tongue. He’s a creep and I hope he gets convicted. He is currently experiencing a trial to take away his bar affiliation in California where he was on the facilty at a law school associated with Chapman University, which is somehow related to the Claremont colleges in CA.
882 chars
susan said on August 16, 2023 at 11:42 pm
Oooo, the Fulton County Jail seems peachy, all right. Well, it is the Peach state. Just the place for that mob of skanks.
274 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 17, 2023 at 3:35 am
“Down on Rice Street” has been mentioned on news coverage. I can assume it has the same connotations as “out on Rikers” or “oh Jesus, you don’t want to be in Cook County”.
172 chars
Julie Robinson said on August 17, 2023 at 2:44 pm
Casey DeSantis is fighting back against the nicknames of Walmart Melania and America’s Karen. If the shoe fits, honey…
120 chars
JodiP said on August 17, 2023 at 4:46 pm
I read the article about the Rice street jail and am horrified. I was a social worker at our county jail, and people are well-fed and get some medical treatment. We have a solid mental health team but for various reasons, people who refuse medications get really, really sick and are often in seclusion with an hour out per day. So,it is still a terrible place to be, and the fact that people are fucking starving in the Rice Street jail is godawful.
I still supervise two social workers who have a lot of contact with incarcerated residents and they work damn hard to get people out when appropriate. I may have mentioned I recently had a guy that I helped get to a nursing home and THE WORK IT TOOK even with this very knowledgable team….was astonishing.
My sentiments about making any humor from this situaiton, from the end of the article: “I wouldn’t wish the conditions in the Fulton County jail on my worst enemy. If you think that making jokes about jail in Atlanta is all well and good because Donald Trump is the butt of them, you may wish to stop and inform yourself of the inhumane ways people have died there.”
1132 chars
Jeff Gill said on August 17, 2023 at 8:38 pm
As the prosecutor’s office keeps saying: it’s open 24/7, drop by anytime!
(Whew. Not that the Licking County Justice Center is any sort of resort facility.)
157 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 18, 2023 at 12:37 am
I have never been incarcerated in a prison but I believe I came very close one time in a Chicago bar. On a slow night in 1976, a friend and I went to a White Sox night game and afterwards went to a bar on Broadway, a packed place full of young people. Nearby , two young women left their table for the ladies room. Shortly after, on the floor, not near any table, I spotted a ten dollar bill. I asked the people at the nearest table if they dropped a tenner…no, nobody had. My back to the vacant table, I did not notice the two women returning, but soon a ruckus erupted and they began yelling at the people at nearby tables about their “stolen” money. Someone pointed at me and my buddy saying they (we) had a lost ten dollar bill…but these women went ballistic, calling the bouncer, saying we had stolen the cash…I laid the money down as the bouncer commanded us to sit and wait for…yeah! the police. Shit. My pal was Roger. I said “Roger, let’s go right the fuck NOW!”
We bolted for the door and ran like hell, as we were both in good running shape way back then, and ran through little yards a couple blocks away where my old VW Microbus was parked on a residential street. I gunned the old bus straight back to the freeway and back to Indiana. I wanted no part of a possible bogus arrest for stealing money from a table in a bar. That shit is absolutely out of my thought-pattern. Anybody who does that should be locked up in Cook County, and I was innocent as a newborn.
1495 chars
Deborah said on August 18, 2023 at 2:17 am
I took a between semesters class in Chicago while I was in college. It was sort of an urban studies class and as part of it we toured Cook County Jail, this was 1972. What an experience that was, a little scary but mostly eye opening. While there we observed some young white guy being booked for trying to poison the water supply somehow, our tour guide told us what was going on. OK, this is amazing, after writing that I decided to Google it and see if I could find the incident from 1972, lo and behold http://www.connectingthewindycity.com/2019/01/january-18-1972-chicago-water-poisoning.html.
598 chars
Deborah said on August 18, 2023 at 2:23 am
This gets weirder, more from Google https://microkhan.com/2013/05/03/the-rise-and-fall-of-r-i-s-e/ The guy in the photo on the left was the one we saw on our Cook County Jail tour. Funny, I would remember what he looked like after all these years.
edit: and more https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=ZO0vAAAAIBAJ&sjid=ZPoDAAAAIBAJ&pg=7281%2C4879303
358 chars
Julie Robinson said on August 18, 2023 at 8:51 am
Jodi, thank you for your compassion and reminding us that everyone deserves to live in decency. Of course Trump and his co-conspirators are the first to deny that to others, so it’s hard not to wish ill on them.
211 chars
Bob (not Greene) said on August 18, 2023 at 10:48 am
Deborah, that’s quite a story!
Here’s what happened to those guys: https://www.latinamericanstudies.org/hijackers/chicagoan.htm
130 chars
JodiP said on August 18, 2023 at 10:58 am
Thank you Julie. Since working in the public defender’s office and connecting with organizers fighting all the injustice, my understanding of the destruction of the criminal court system has deepened.
200 chars
Jeff Borden said on August 18, 2023 at 1:36 pm
FDChief,
I’m not a man of violence, but there are other ways to fight these seditious weasels. I have money and an abundance of time as a retiree. I heavily support the ACLU, Planned Parenthood and the Human Rights Campaign. I’ve also contributed to numerous individual political campaigns. But, yeah, you’re correct. Cletus McMoron from Bug Tussle, tRumpland will never be satisfied. We’ll just have to marginalize them and their malign influence. And wait for them to die off.
479 chars
jcburns said on August 18, 2023 at 3:21 pm
Cletus really ought to see if he can get his name changed.
58 chars
Deborah said on August 18, 2023 at 4:59 pm
Bob (Not G) I had read that Schwander died in a Cuban prison but I’ve been trying to find out what happened to the other guy Pera, where he is now, if he’s still alive. He’d be 69 or 70 now, he’s the one I saw being booked in Cook County jail during that Urban Studies tour in 1972. Of course I didn’t know anything about him then except he was being booked for trying to poison the Chicago water supply, until last night when I googled that incident after remembering it when I was conveying my experience touring Cook County jail. It’s amazing to me how the internet can connect you to something you barely remember.
618 chars
Dave said on August 18, 2023 at 5:47 pm
I see that Wendy Robinson, longtime Fort Wayne Community Schools superintendent, has passed away, only three years after retiring. Sad that she didn’t get to have a long retirement. Longtime NNC participant and regular school board meeting attendee, Brian Stouder, always spoke highly of her.
Fortunately, I’ve no jail experience. I’ve a close family relative who spent one night in a jail and hearing his story was bad enough.
435 chars
Julie Robinson said on August 18, 2023 at 6:25 pm
Dave, Wendy Robinson’s death made me sad too, only three years after retiring. I saw a picture of her a year or so back and she looked gaunt; thinking it was cancer or some other wretched long-term thing. She poured her life into the school system and it would have been nice if she’d had more time to enjoy retirement. (We are not related.)
341 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 19, 2023 at 5:20 am
I just saw a little mini-tour of Rice Street . Dirty, nasty, huge globs of black mold behind every door. LOCK HIM UP !! And specify Rice Street.
147 chars
Deborah said on August 19, 2023 at 10:19 am
I listened to an interesting podcast by Mona Charen of Bulwark about the Evangelical ideology and how Trump is not the antitheses of Christian beliefs to them but the culmination of everything they have believed over time. Kristin Du Mez is one of the guests and offers an analysis of the history leading up to the situation today. Mona Charen and the Bulwark are on the center right of the political spectrum for sure, I’m further to the left of what they usually focus on but I found this extremely insightful, explaining a lot of the why and how it happened that the Christian Evangelicals have embraced Trump and his MAGA agenda. I recommend it https://www.thebulwark.com/podcast/beg-to-differ/ I only listened to the first half of the podcast because the second half went on to a different subject.
803 chars
jcburns said on August 19, 2023 at 12:07 pm
“Trump is not the antitheses of Christian beliefs to them but the culmination of everything they have believed over time.”
Naaah, not buying it.
147 chars
FDChief said on August 19, 2023 at 12:16 pm
Deborah: IIRC Fred Clarke over at Slacktivist has a fairly straightforward look at the fundagelical connection that links it directly to the intrinsic racism of the fundies and from there to their abortion fixation.
The fundie churches lost the Civil (Rights) War. They were on the wrong side of history in the Fifties thru the Seventies. Their options were 1) repent, atone, and reform, or 2) find another cause they could use to be the Good Guys again.
Enter abortion.
But to do that came with the must move to the GOP. Just like the Dixiecrats, the fundies could find no home alongside people who were at least okay with everything the fundies haaaaated; sex, especially non-het sex, racial equity, tolerance of everything not strictly patriarchal…but abortion was the key to making all that other stuff okay.
And none of that has really changed even as MAGA has ripped the veneer off the ignorant vicious Gilded Age greed that has been the GOP since 1932.
Where can they go? To the Dems? That’d mean having to jettison the panty-sniffing, racist, patriarchy that’s been key to who they are.
Or – as they did – find justification for the anti-Christian tenets of their MAGAt allies.
So…
1218 chars
Mark P said on August 19, 2023 at 2:54 pm
@jcburns — Surely you saw images of the Fort Oglethorpe billboard comparing Trump to Jesus. The one with “For into a son is given … “ You can’t get much more explicit than that.
187 chars
brian stouder said on August 19, 2023 at 3:42 pm
Dr Robinson definitely did the work, that’s for sure. None of it could have been easy, and it looked to me like she went right at it, and conclusively dealt with it, every single day.
185 chars
Mark P said on August 19, 2023 at 3:43 pm
Darn the iPhone keyboard — “unto” not “into”. Plus one bad eye that’s causing depth perception problems. The entire quote was “For unto us a son is given and the government shall be upon his shoulders.”
218 chars
jcburns said on August 19, 2023 at 3:49 pm
@markP, yeah, that’s pretty bad.
I always wonder whether these folks have read up on Trump’s upbringing and his dad’s…uh…issues?
They probably don’t care. I want to yell out the car window “Trump’s family is insane! Stay away from them!”…but.
254 chars
ROGirl said on August 19, 2023 at 4:08 pm
Their fucking messiah? THAT’S insane.
37 chars
Mark P said on August 19, 2023 at 4:37 pm
To be fair, the billboard was taken down petty quickly. One minister was appalled. One Trump supporter said he didn’t think Trump was Jesus, only that he was a man of god. So they are not all completely around the bend. Some of them are still just barely visible before the road takes the final turn into Crazytown.
317 chars
Sherri said on August 19, 2023 at 4:56 pm
When I speak of white evangelicals, I really speak of Southern Baptists, which is my experience of white evangelicals. Right there in the name is the giveaway: *Southern* Baptists. This is a denomination formed to support slavery. It is a denomination that very much believes in a hierarchical world order, with white Christian men on top. They will tell you this is Biblical. Of course, they no longer support slavery, but they were on the wrong side of the civil rights movement, and only started caring about abortion when it was no longer okay to fight for racism and segregation and Jim Crow.
They’ve always looked for ways in which they were persecuted, and have always believed that Armageddon was happening soon. The Southern Baptist Sunday School teacher Jimmy Carter never captured their love, because he was sending the IRS after Bob Jones University, which wasn’t Southern Baptist, but who knew where that would end.
Trump, despite his personal issues, tells them they’re right, they belong on top, they’re the real Americans, and he hates all the people they do. Of course, they don’t think they hate anybody, but actions speak pretty loud. “Hate the sin, love the sinner”, but some sinners get a lot more grace and love than others. Southern Baptists became anti-abortion while remaining very much pro-death penalty, for example.
1364 chars
Sherri said on August 19, 2023 at 5:52 pm
I’ll add, I’ve found that accusing people of hypocrisy is useless. Not just because it doesn’t accomplish anything, but because usually, what you see as hypocrisy is really a failure to understand their values.
Rather than point out hypocrisy, I prefer to assume that people act in accordance with their values, regardless of what they say those values are. If evangelicals are fine with Trump, then that shows what their real values are.
448 chars
Little Bird said on August 19, 2023 at 6:01 pm
It’s not just southern or baptist. I’m not sure if my extended family would go so far as to declare him the Messiah, but it would be a near thing. The Missouri Synod Lutheran church is wildly trumptastic. Which completely baffles me.
240 chars
Sherri said on August 19, 2023 at 6:19 pm
Neil Gaiman with good advice on choosing a political party:
“As far as I’m concerned, if you really can’t figure out which political party or which politician to vote for, just ask if they’re on the side of libraries. Are they voting to fund their libraries? Are they voting to keep them free? Then vote for those guys. They’re probably the good guys. And by the same token, the book burners, the book banners, they’re probably the bad guys. It’s a good way to bet.”
473 chars
Deborah said on August 19, 2023 at 7:19 pm
If you listen to the podcast it makes a lot of sense, a lot of what they had to say centered around evangelical’s skewed perspective on masculinity and manliness. Victorian practices of masculinity, which were more about the gentleman, and proper behavior etc prevailed up to a certain point, but there was a backlash based on poorer folks and their struggles, the western myths that evolved and so on. The manly myths came to be based on individualism and things like protecting the family (that they were considered the God given head, of course) out of that much later came things like Oath Keepers and such. Evangelicals became not much concerned about unfaithfulness to wives or family, based on their willingness to forgive pastors and youth pastors for transgressions, blaming it on women who seduce, not on the man’s weakness or sinfulness. That’s why Trump’s hush money, multiple wives and affairs is not a flaw to them. They didn’t specifically mention this on the podcast but abortion is just another way to lord it over women and be the macho man in charge, it’s not really that it’s taking the life of the unborn, that’s only the pretense they use to be up in arms about. The teachings of Jesus, turn the other cheek, love thy neighbor, have long been ignored as weak. The fact that they see Trump as manly is weird, he smears make up on (fake tanning lotion), he’s as vain as can be about his hair, he doesn’t care about the fitness of his body, only tries to hide it with baggy suits and long ties. So manly, no.
edit: Trump also didn’t serve his country during war, got out of it with fake bone spurs, also not manly.
1634 chars
jcburns said on August 19, 2023 at 9:46 pm
Yeah, but “it makes a lot of sense” in terms of the podcast people’s theory of evangelicals…I guess I just want to say I don’t need that stuff in my head when the planet is falling apart.
So I don’t listen. Yes, you are welcome to listen. But I DO NOT LISTEN.
We don’t have to figure Trump and his supporters out in order to oppose them. I oppose him, and them.
Phew.
378 chars
Suzanne said on August 19, 2023 at 10:53 pm
I have been reading Jeff Sharlet’s book The Undertow. This is basically one of the chapters. It’s terrifying.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/11/america-new-civil-war
179 chars
Deborah said on August 19, 2023 at 11:24 pm
I don’t “need” to understand MAGA evangelicals sure, but I have relatives and (former unfortunately) friends that espouse that stuff and it baffles me. When I say it makes a lot of sense doesn’t mean I think it’s right, it shows me a sequence of events that led to the way things currently are. Getting a background on how it all came to be is interesting to me, it doesn’t excuse their behavior but it helps me understand its origins. Just like learning history helps, reading the 1690 project etc and listening to Heather Cox Richardsons podcast or reading her substack letters helps me put it in perspective. I find it helpful for my own sanity. I used to be astounded how the vast number of German people could be duped by Hitler and how Hitler realized they were ripe for exploitation, but now I get how it can happen and wouldn’t it be great if we could learn from that and stop it in its tracks someday.
And believe me I realize the planet is falling apart related to climate change and I pay a lot of attention to that too. We don’t discuss that subject as often on nn.c.
1082 chars
Dexter Friend said on August 20, 2023 at 1:10 am
I didn’t realize sun-baked sand is as firm as caliche when it comes to water run-off. Palm Springs and a lot of other areas are in for it.
As Washington burns up, Canadian fires, more than 100 in number, rage on. Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Illinois are getting the worst of it shortly, the smoke.
298 chars
ROGirl said on August 20, 2023 at 6:17 am
I read “The Undertow” and found it disturbing and depressing. My thoughts went straight to the parallels of this stuff with Hitler and Nazi propaganda.
151 chars
Little Bird said on August 20, 2023 at 9:12 am
There is something to be said about knowing one’s enemies.
60 chars
FDChief said on August 20, 2023 at 11:05 am
The difference is that Germans in the Thirties had been dragged into a world war by their George W. Bush-emperor whose minions then (after killing millions) lost it, endured a minor civil war, then a crushing hyperinflation and Depression.
The MAGAts had to push 1 for English.
So there’s no real parallels. The people in this country who make up the GOP base are meatbags who have finally been treated to the opportunity to take their greed, stupidity, theocracy, racism and every other -ism, out for a walk in public. So no. There’s no real point in trying to “understand” why they’re like that, any more than it’s worth understanding why a gibbering lunatic thinks they’re Napoleon. It’s nonsense, and all it’ll do is make you despise them more because they’re burning out house down out of that pure vindictive nonsense.
At least cockroaches are useful for providing prey for other animals. MAGAts? Waste of otherwise perfectly good oxygen.
973 chars
Deborah said on August 20, 2023 at 5:06 pm
Do we not think it’s important to learn from history so we don’t let bad things happen again? The rightwingers don’t want to allow students to learn how bad slavery was and how our forefathers let it happen and participated in it or about how systematic racism is rampant and has been for generations. We think suppressing that is wrong don’t we? How is it different to learn about how evangelicals lost their way and turned into monsters who advocate violence? I’m not saying spend all of your time and energy learning how these things happened but when it’s presented to you in an engaging and interesting way, like a podcast, why not?
637 chars
Jeff Borden said on August 20, 2023 at 7:23 pm
It’s abundantly clear the modern ‘Murican conservative movement wants to create more dumb people because they are so easily manipulated and bamboozled. What’s funny is many of the leaders of the right are highly educated men and women, but they do everything possible to hide their elite educations.
You ever listen to the drawling douchebaggery of Sen. John Kennedy of Louisiana? Sounds like Mr. Haney from “Green Acres?” He’s a Rhodes Scholar. The Meathead in Floriduh? DeathSantis? Yale and Harvard. Rafael Cruz? Princeton and Harvard. Josh “Manly Man” Hawley? Stanford and Yale…preceded by pricey private academies. Even tRump, who’s as dumb as a fence post, brags about his degree from Pennsylvania, though not to the rubes who send him their Social Security checks in the belief he’s their own personal Jaysus.
Why do you think they want to limit college students’ access to the polls? Why does that piece of shit Vivek Whatshisname want to raise the age to legally vote to 25? Why does Texas allow a gun license to count as proper ID to vote, but not a university or college ID card?
Conservatism in ‘Murica is a deadend. Millennials and Gen Z hate ’em. They’re aging out and the new generation already is laughing. So, sure, turn our schools into happy, shiny places where nothing bad ever, ever, ever happened in our benighted Eden. Idiots. Ignorance delivers nothing positive.
1397 chars
LAMary said on August 20, 2023 at 7:25 pm
The week here at Casa LAMary: Sunday colonoscopy prep, Monday barfing up colonoscopy prep stuff so no colonoscopy, just endoscopy, followed by another colonoscopy prep. Tuesday colonoscopy, weird reaction to anethesia (small red spots all over ankles and calves). Wednesday, three hour training video about commercial sex exploitation of children. Thursday more training videos, none as grim as Wednesday’s. Friday results of scoping, nothing scary. Saturday, washing machine dies. Realization that a working washing machine would be very useful after two days of induced watery stool but there’s a great laundromat three doors down from the best taco place in NELA according to me and Jonathan Gold. Sunday, earthquake and all day rain.
738 chars
FDChief said on August 20, 2023 at 8:48 pm
Deborah: the problem is that what we’re “learning” from the MAGAts is “stupid vile shitheads gonna stupid vile shitty stuff”. How does that actually help? How do we use that to change or prevent these shitty people from doing these shitty things?
I’m all in favor of learning from history. But that implies there’s a way to change the outcome. How does that work here?
It’s not like these people don’t know what they’re doing. They LOVE what they’re doing! Making liberals cry? If that means killing a few homos or uppity wimmen? Win-win!
566 chars
Deborah said on August 20, 2023 at 9:06 pm
I’m not saying that it’s important to know what MAGAts are doing now, but I do think it’s important to know how it got this way generations ago, so that we learn how these things start and what the consequences can be down the road. We tend to brush it off when it starts and when people start raising red flags they’re considered to be overblowing it. There are ways to change the outcome, as Marc Elias is showing us, if you follow Democracy Docket. Let’s not throw up our hands and say nothing can be done. We aren’t going to change the dumbfucks but we can make efforts to use the law to stop them. Recognizing what is happening as it’s happening is critical.
663 chars
Jeff Gill said on August 20, 2023 at 10:12 pm
Mary, very sorry about your cluster of a week. Hoping the rains pass by as gently as possible. And no more shaking!
115 chars
LAMary said on August 20, 2023 at 11:27 pm
I figure I got a lot of bad stuff out of the way in one week. Training videos for tomorrow include Globally Harmonized Symbols. I can ace the post training quiz on that one. Already did HIPPA in half the allotted time. I’ve been working in some form of healthcare for way too long. And thank you for the good wishes, Jeff G. I will try not to shake. And the good news is I don’t have colon or esophageal cancer. This makes me the only one among my siblings who doesn’t have one or the other plus type 2 diabetes and/or skin cancer. Boo yah.
540 chars
JodiP said on August 21, 2023 at 9:13 am
LAMary, I hope the flooding isn’t too terrible. Congrats on the screening outcomes, too!
FDChief, I have an ask for dignified language when talking about people with serious mental illnesses: “gibbering lunatic thinks they’re Napoleon” made my gut clench. For all we know, someone here could have bipolar disorder or schizophrenia that is well-treated with medication and support. In my career, I have worked with many people who suffer, and talked with mamy a parent who saw their beloved, bright, funny young adult child melt away before their eyes. I hope one day we have a true cure for something so viscious. In the meantime, they deserve our respect and compassion. They are not making a choice to have this illness. Many Americans are making choices to be racist, homophobic, etc, etc. It is unkind to compare them to people with these diseases, no matter the language we use.
888 chars
jcburns said on August 21, 2023 at 10:11 am
I think the assumption Mona Charen can be one’s guide through the insanity of Trump world is not…good.
And her online “home”—The Bulwark—is also troubling. Bill Kristol. Charlie Sykes.
Yikes!
203 chars
FDChief said on August 21, 2023 at 1:56 pm
Deborah: Wellll…I’d agree, if there was and sort of mystery to “why are garbage people garbage”. But we know why; toxic masculinity, toxic religion, toxic parents, systemic racism and homophobia…it’s not like we don’t know where these people have been coming from since 1776 and beyond.
And for what now seems like an all-too-brief while many of us tried to change that. Civil rights. Pride. Separating church and state.
And, predictably, the garbage people haaaaaated all that. They have been all in for their toxic leaders going back to the Taft Republicans in the Thirties and Forties. Birchers. Goldwater. Reagan. Gingrich. Limbaugh. Trump is just the latest froth on the scum frappe’.
The thing I see as troublesome about doing these Cletus safaris is that they lend attention and often legitimacy to the people who should be tossed out with the other garbage. We know perfectly well who they are and why without giving them anymore airtime.
971 chars